Babcock & Wilcox Enterprises Inc (BW) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good evening. My name is Joe and I will be your conference operator today. (Operator Instructions)

晚安.我叫喬，今天我將擔任你們的會議操作員。（操作員說明）

Thank you. Sharyn, you may begin your conference call.

謝謝。Sharyn，您可以開始電話會議了。

Thank you, Joe, and thanks to everyone for joining us on Babcock & Wilcox Enterprises' fourth-quarter and full-year 2023 earnings conference call. I'm Sharyn Brooks, Director of Communications. Joining the call today are Kenny Young, B&W's Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, and Lou Salomon, Chief Financial Officer, to discuss our fourth quarter and full year 2023 results during this call.

謝謝 Joe，也謝謝大家參加 Babcock & Wilcox Enterprises 的 2023 年第四季和全年財報電話會議。我是莎琳‧布魯克斯，通訊總監。今天參加電話會議的還有 B&W 董事長兼執行長 Kenny Young 和財務長 Lou Salomon，他們在電話會議中討論了我們第四季和 2023 年全年的業績。

Certain statements we make will be forward looking. These statements are subject to risks and uncertainties, including those set forth in our safe harbor provision for forward-looking statements that can be found at the end of our earnings press release and in our annual report on Form 10-K that will be filed with the SEC tomorrow, March 15, 2024. Additionally, except as required by law, we undertake no obligation to update any forward-looking statements.

我們所做的某些聲明將具有前瞻性。這些陳述受到風險和不確定性的影響，包括我們的前瞻性陳述的安全港條款中規定的風險和不確定性，這些風險和不確定性可以在我們的收益新聞稿末尾以及我們將提交的10 -K 表格年度報告中找到。明天，2024 年 3 月 15 日，美國證券交易委員會 (SEC)。此外，除非法律要求，我們不承擔更新任何前瞻性聲明的義務。

We also provide non-GAAP information regarding certain of our historical and targeted results to supplement the results provided in accordance with GAAP. This information should not be considered superior to or as a substitute for the comparable GAAP measures.

我們還提供有關我們的某些歷史和目標結果的非 GAAP 信息，以補充根據 GAAP 提供的結果。該資訊不應被視為優於或替代可比較的 GAAP 衡量標準。

A reconciliation of historical non-GAAP measures can be found in our fourth quarter and full year earnings release published this afternoon and in our Company overview presentation filed on Form 8-K tomorrow, March 15, 2024, and posted on the Investor Relations section of our website at babcock.com.

歷史非GAAP 指標的調節可以在我們今天下午發布的第四季度和全年收益報告中找到，也可以在我們於明天（即2024 年3 月15 日）表格8-K 上提交的公司概況介紹中找到，並發佈在投資者關係部分。我們的網站為 babcock.com。

I will now turn the call over to Kenny.

我現在將把電話轉給肯尼。

Thanks, Sharon, and thanks, Joel, and good afternoon, everyone, and thanks for joining us on our fourth quarter and full year 2023 earnings call. We're very excited to be here today as we enter 2024 and believe this year will prove to be a very strong year for Babcock & Wilcox in terms of performance and continued execution of our strategic plans.

謝謝莎倫，謝謝喬爾，大家下午好，謝謝您參加我們的 2023 年第四季和全年財報電話會議。進入 2024 年，我們很高興今天能來到這裡，並相信今年對於 Babcock & Wilcox 來說在業績和戰略計劃的持續執行方面將是非常強勁的一年。

Last quarter, we announced a series of strategic actions that would reduce costs and increased focus on our higher margin core businesses as well as continue our efforts around bright lube and climate bright. As such, we are expanding our staff and revamping our presence and seeing new opportunities in waste to energy, specifically in the United States as well as in Europe and Australia through an improved pipeline of selective and higher-margin opportunities with the recent EPA announcements.

上季度，我們宣布了一系列戰略行動，這些行動將降低成本，更加關注利潤率較高的核心業務，並繼續圍繞明亮潤滑油和氣候明亮做出努力。因此，我們正在擴大我們的員工隊伍，改進我們的業務，並透過最近美國環保署的公告，透過改進選擇性和高利潤機會的管道，在廢物能源化領域看到新的機會，特別是在美國、歐洲和澳洲。

We are also seeing waste energy environmental opportunities as facilities in the United States are required to improve emission controls and flue gas treatment. We are also expanding our Thermal segment, higher margin parts and services and seeing more opportunities around gas conversion.

我們也看到了廢能環境的機會，因為美國的設施需要改善排放控制和煙氣處理。我們也正在擴大我們的熱力部門、更高利潤的零件和服務，並看到更多圍繞天然氣轉換的機會。

We are growing our renewable services presence in Europe and see growth opportunities over the next several years, we are seeing increased activities and have doubled the amount of our paid carbon capture FEED studies, and some of those should eventually lead to full project engagements to deploy our carbon capture technologies. We are also continuing our efforts to deploy our BrightLeaf technology, and we'll discuss that a little bit more later.

我們正在擴大我們在歐洲的可再生服務業務，並看到未來幾年的成長機會，我們看到活動增加，付費碳捕獲FEED 研究的數量增加了一倍，其中一些最終應該會導致全面的專案參與部署我們的碳捕獲技術。我們也將繼續努力部署 BrightLeaf 技術，稍後我們將對此進行更多討論。

Looking at our full year financial performance. We continue to display year-over-year improvement in adjusted EBITDA, which helped drive our full year results in line with our 2023 adjusted EBITDA target range. We achieved double-digit revenue growth across all business segments, driven by increased activity and expansion into our key end markets, particularly in our Environmental segment, which saw a 31% year-over-year increase.

看看我們全年的財務表現。我們繼續顯示調整後 EBITDA 的年比改善，這有助於推動我們的全年業績符合 2023 年調整後 EBITDA 目標範圍。在主要終端市場活動增加和擴張的推動下，我們所有業務部門的收入均實現了兩位數成長，尤其是環境部門，比去年同期成長了 31%。

We also continued to make progress in converting our now over $9 billion global pipeline of identified project opportunities to bookings, as shown in our consolidated top line improvement when compared to last year our pipeline includes over 1.5 billion of climate bright and bright Leupp opportunities as well. And we are confident and have reason to believe that our bookings in 2024 will be one of the highest in recent history.

我們也將目前價值超過90 億美元的全球已確定專案機會轉化為預訂方面繼續取得進展，與去年相比，我們的綜合營收改善表明，我們的管道還包括超過15 億個氣候明亮和明亮的Leupp 機會。我們有信心並且有理由相信我們 2024 年的預訂量將是近年來歷史上最高的之一。

In fact, we expect to announce a large gas conversion project on Monday morning, the underlying industry trends resulting from strong global demand for clean power production and energy security underpin our pipeline and outlook for sustained growth in 2024 and beyond.

事實上，我們預計將於週一上午宣布一個大型天然氣轉換項目，全球對清潔電力生產的強勁需求和能源安全所帶來的潛在行業趨勢支撐著我們的管道和 2024 年及以後持續增長的前景。

Our year end backlog was short of our expectations, but this is largely due to longer than anticipated negotiations on a few new opportunities. The majority of the delays were due to an increased scope for B & W's aftermarket services as many utilities and large energy companies are reevaluate or reevaluating projects due to higher interest rates.

我們的年終積壓未達到我們的預期，但這主要是由於一些新機會的談判時間比預期長。大部分延誤是由於 B & W 售後服務範圍擴大，因為許多公用事業公司和大型能源公司因利率上升而重新評估或重新評估專案。

However, we have seen continued interest from utilities in North America and around the world on extending the life of their thermal generating assets and replacing coal or oil with cleaner burning fuels like natural gas, biofuels or hydrogen, with increased visibility into our near term booking opportunities we are reiterating our full year 2020 for adjusted EBITDA target of $100 million to $110 million, which excludes bright loop and climate bright.

然而，我們看到北美和世界各地的公用事業公司對延長其火力發電資產的使用壽命以及用天然氣、生物燃料或氫氣等更清潔的燃燒燃料取代煤炭或石油持續感興趣，這增加了我們近期預訂的可見性我們重申 2020 年全年調整後 EBITDA 目標為 1 億至 1.1 億美元，其中不包括 Bright Loop 和 Climate Bright。

We continue, though to invest in our bright loop opportunities and anticipate spending around five to $9 million in 2024 on our bright loop projects and technology advancements, reflecting on what was another year of challenging macro economic conditions, primarily due to the higher interest rate environment of today.

不過，我們將繼續投資於我們的Bright Loop 機會，並預計2024 年將在Bright Loop 項目和技術進步上支出約5 至900 萬美元，這反映出宏觀經濟狀況又一年充滿挑戰，這主要是由於利率環境較高今天的。

We remain focused on delivering strong execution across our parts and services business, which continue to perform above our expectations and contribute meaningfully towards our cash flow, cash flow and revenue generation. We see this focus as an instrumental next step to deleverage the balance sheet and improve the liquidity profile of our business.

我們仍然專注於在我們的零件和服務業務中提供強大的執行力，這些業務的表現繼續超出我們的預期，並對我們的現金流量、現金流量和創收做出有意義的貢獻。我們認為這一重點是去槓桿化資產負債表和改善我們業務流動性狀況的重要一步。

As a part of our announced strategic business realignment, we have taken significant steps to realign the Company for improved financial performance in 2020 fourth, driven by several key initiatives that are expected to deliver more predictable cash flow generation and improved financial performance through higher margin opportunities.

作為我們宣布的策略性業務調整的一部分，我們已採取重大步驟來調整公司，以改善2020 年第四季度的財務業績，在幾項關鍵舉措的推動下，這些舉措預計將帶來更可預測的現金流生成，並透過更高的利潤機會改善財務表現。

As a result, we will continue to reduce our reliance on high cost, low margin new-build projects, which in turn will allow us to reduce the associated overhead and interest costs. In parallel, we remain on track to realize our expected annualized cost savings target of over $30 million and reduce our interest expense. To date, we have successfully realized more than $19 billion in cost savings and he's established a new $150 million senior secured credit facility and received a reaffirmed credit rating of A. double B plus from Egan Jones.

因此，我們將繼續減少對高成本、低利潤新建專案的依賴，這反過來又將使我們能夠減少相關的管理費用和利息成本。同時，我們仍有望實現超過 3,000 萬美元的預期年度成本節約目標，並減少利息支出。迄今為止，我們已成功實現了超過 190 億美元的成本節約，他還建立了新的 1.5 億美元高級擔保信貸額度，並獲得了 Egan Jones 重申的 A. 雙 B+ 信用評級。

These developments not only enhance our liquidity profile and provide an additional annual interest cost savings of approximately $5 million, but also allow for more flexible flexibility in our use of capital to support letters of credit drive renewable energy growth and deliver on other potential accretive business initiatives. The reaffirmation of our credit rating and our new senior secured credit facility reflect the stability of our business model and our continued commitment to our long term growth capabilities.

這些發展不僅增強了我們的流動性狀況，每年額外節省約 500 萬美元的利息成本，而且還使我們能夠更加靈活地使用資本來支持信用證推動可再生能源增長並實現其他潛在的增值業務計劃。我們的信用評級和新的優先擔保信貸額度的重申反映了我們業務模式的穩定性以及我們對長期成長能力的持續承諾。

Additionally, it bolsters our efforts to support multiyear projects and capitalize on future growth through our evolving bright loop and climate bright technology opportunities with our recent strategy changes, we are confident in realizing stronger cash flows from our thermal operations as we continue to expand and implement our new renewable technologies, including hydrogen production and carbon capture.

此外，它加強了我們支持多年項目的努力，並透過我們不斷發展的明亮循環和氣候明亮技術機會以及我們最近的戰略變化來利用未來的增長，我們有信心隨著我們繼續擴大和實施，我們的熱力業務將實現更強勁的現金流我們的新可再生技術，包括氫氣生產和碳捕獲。

Looking forward, we anticipate 2024 to be a pivotal year for our decarbonization platform and deployment of our bright loop technology. At commercial scale, we have doubled our activity around carbon capture FEED studies and are optimistic. These efforts will translate into potential projects in 2024 for utility scale carbon capture technology. On BrightLeaf specifically, we've achieved several key milestones to date across this project portfolio.

展望未來，我們預計 2024 年將是我們的脫碳平台和部署 Bright Loop 技術的關鍵一年。在商業規模上，我們圍繞碳捕獲 FEED 研究的活動增加了一倍，並且對此持樂觀態度。這些努力將在 2024 年轉化為公用事業規模碳捕集技術的潛在項目。具體來說，在 BrightLeaf 上，迄今為止，我們在該專案組合中實現了幾個關鍵里程碑。

With respect to financing and offtake arrangements, as mentioned, we have increased our investment in bright loop and bright new projects in 2024 and continue our development activities as each project is at various stages.

在融資和承購安排方面，如上所述，我們在 2024 年增加了對 Bright Loop 和 Bright New 專案的投資，並根據每個專案處於不同階段的情況繼續進行開發活動。

As discussed previously, we are developing a small hydrogen production plant and mass on Ohio. Not too far from our headquarters and accurate. In addition to the previously announced letter of intent for Project five project global financing, we are also negotiating final offtake agreements and working diligently to finalize the construction cost estimates for this project.

如前所述，我們正在俄亥俄州開發一座小型氫氣工廠和大規模氫氣工廠。離我們總部不太遠而且準確。除了先前公佈的項目五項目全球融資意向書外，我們還在談判最終承購協議，並努力完成該項目的建設成本估算。

With respect to our medium and larger platforms, we've been awarded a $16 million grant from the energy matching funds program of the Wyoming energy authority to fund the permitting engineering and initial construction activities for our Black Hills project.

對於我們的中型和大型平台，我們從懷俄明州能源局的能源匹配基金計劃中獲得了 1600 萬美元的贈款，用於資助 Black Hills 項目的許可工程和初步建設活動。

We have a great partner with Black Hills Energy, and we are working together to further progress this project, which will utilize local coal to produce low carbon intensity hydrogen while sequestering the carbon dioxide. This award is a testament to the progress we've made in our efforts to develop a clean and clean hydrogen generation facility with CO2 capture.

我們與 Black Hills Energy 是一個很好的合作夥伴，我們正在共同努力進一步推進這個項目，該項目將利用當地煤炭生產低碳強度的氫氣，同時封存二氧化碳。該獎項證明了我們在開發具有二氧化碳捕獲功能的潔淨氫氣設施方面所取得的進展。

We also continued to progress our Louisiana bright blue project and have signed a memorandum of understanding with Air Products and General Hydrogen to enter into a definitive offtake agreement for what could be up to 215 tons of carbon negative hydrogen offtake per day, as well as the CO2 produced at the facility.

我們也繼續推進我們的路易斯安那亮藍色項目，並與空氣產品公司和通用氫能公司簽署了一份諒解備忘錄，簽署了最終的承購協議，每天可承購高達215 噸碳負氫，以及工廠產生的二氧化碳。

We are in discussions around fuel availability and fuel supply agreements, and we are engaging with several potential investors who are attracted to the project's net negative carbon intensity characteristics based on our experiences and interactions we've received to date and continued progress with prospective new build project opportunities.

我們正在圍繞燃料可用性和燃料供應協議進行討論，並且我們正在與幾位潛在投資者進行接觸，根據我們迄今為止收到的經驗和互動以及未來新建項目的持續進展，他們被該項目的淨負碳強度特徵所吸引專案機會。

It has become clear that the demand for commercial solutions that address carbon neutral targets is continuing to grow. Additionally, we continue to see potential for new projects related to waste to energy in the United States and expect higher margin opportunities to arise for our broader climate bright technologies.

很明顯，對實現碳中和目標的商業解決方案的需求正在持續增長。此外，我們繼續看到美國與廢物能源相關的新項目的潛力，並預計我們更廣泛的氣候明亮技術將出現更高的利潤機會。

To reiterate, our updated pipeline is over $9 billion across all three segments, with approximately $1.5 billion in bright lube and climate bright opportunities alone. We believe this puts us on a pathway to reach $1 billion in bookings by 2028, with combinations of small, medium and large bright blue projects, we feel confident that could lead to $1 billion in revenues by 2030, which still only represents roughly 1% of the market share for total hydrogen spend by 2030.

重申一下，我們更新的管道在所有三個領域都超過 90 億美元，其中僅明亮潤滑油和氣候明亮機會就約有 15 億美元。我們相信，這將使我們的預訂量到2028 年達到10 億美元，透過小型、中型和大型亮藍色項目的組合，我們有信心到2030 年實現10 億美元的收入，但仍僅佔大約1 %到 2030 年，氫氣總支出的市佔率。

We look forward to deploying these technologies at scale and further developing our suite of carbon capture solutions and ultimately leveraging our climate bright decarbonization platform and supported industry legislation to further diversify our environmental and renewable businesses.

我們期待大規模部署這些技術，並進一步開發我們的碳捕獲解決方案套件，並最終利用我們的氣候友善脫碳平台和支援的產業立法，進一步使我們的環境和再生業務多元化。

I'll now turn the call over to Lou, who will discuss the financial details of the fourth quarter and full year 2023. Lou?

我現在將電話轉給 Lou，他將討論第四季和 2023 年全年的財務細節。盧？

Thanks, Kenny. First, I'll review our full year 2023 results, and then I'll turn to our fourth quarter 2023 results for further detail. I call your attention to the fact that we will file our 10 K with the SEC tomorrow, March 15th, 2024, and you can refer to it for further details beyond what we discuss in this call.

謝謝，肯尼。首先，我將回顧我們 2023 年全年業績，然後我將轉向 2023 年第四季業績以了解更多詳細資訊。我提請您注意，我們將於明天（即 2024 年 3 月 15 日）向 SEC 提交 10 K，您可以參考該文件以了解我們在本次電話會議中討論的更多詳細資訊。

Consolidated revenues for 2023 were $999.4 million. That's an 18% improvement compared to 2022. This improvement was primarily due to higher level of activity across all of our segments.

2023 年合併收入為 9.994 億美元。與 2022 年相比，提高了 18%。這項改善主要是由於我們所有部門的活動水準提高。

Our net loss in 2023 was $78.6 million as compared to a net loss of $20 million in 2022. And this is related to primarily to the overall increase in costs and expenses are higher interest expense and increase in foreign exchange losses and goodwill impairment expense.

我們 2023 年的淨虧損為 7,860 萬美元，而 2022 年的淨虧損為 2,000 萬美元。這主要與成本和費用的整體增加​​有關，即利息費用的增加以及匯兌損失和商譽減損費用的增加。

Gaap operating income in 2023 was $19.9 million compared to operating income of $2.3 million in 2022. We achieved our revised 2023 adjusted EBITDA target, excluding bright loop and climate bright expenses with an adjusted EBITDA of $84.1 million as compared to $71.8 million in 2022.

2023 年公認的會計準則營業收入為 1,990 萬美元，而 2022 年的營業收入為 230 萬美元。我們實現了修訂後的 2023 年調整後 EBITDA 目標（不包括明亮循環和氣候明亮費用），調整後 EBITDA 為 8,410 萬美元，而 2022 年為 7,180 萬美元。

Total bookings in 2023 were $878 million, an increase of 2% compared to the full year 2022 backlog at December 31st, 2023 was $530 million, which is a slight decrease compared to the prior year end.

2023 年總預訂量為 8.78 億美元，較截至 2023 年 12 月 31 日的 2022 年全年積壓訂單 5.3 億美元增長 2%，與上年末相比略有下降。

Let me now turn to our fourth quarter results. Fourth quarter consolidated revenues were $227.2 million. This is a 4% decline compared to the fourth quarter of 2022. This decline was primarily attributed to lower volumes in our renewables segment as a result, as a result of the completion of some lower margin, new build work and the combination of our strategic shift away from these lower margin new build businesses.

現在讓我談談我們第四季的業績。第四季合併收入為 2.272 億美元。與 2022 年第四季相比下降了 4%。這一下降主要歸因於我們的再生能源部門的銷售下降，這是由於完成了一些利潤率較低的新建工程以及我們從這些利潤率較低的新建業務的策略轉移的結果。

Net loss in the fourth quarter of 2023 was $54.3 million as compared to a net income of $2.5 million in the fourth quarter of 2022. And this was primarily due to non-cash adjustments for pension accounts. Our GAAP operating income in the fourth quarter of 2023 was 700,000 as compared to operating income of $6.3 million in the fourth quarter of 2022.

2023 年第四季的淨虧損為 5,430 萬美元，而 2022 年第四季的淨收入為 250 萬美元。這主要是由於退休金帳戶的非現金調整。我們 2023 年第四季的 GAAP 營業收入為 70 萬美元，而 2022 年第四季的營業收入為 630 萬美元。

Adjusted EBITDA was $19.5 million in the fourth quarter of 2023 compared to $21 million in the fourth quarter of 2022. Bookings in the fourth quarter of 2023 were $250 million, a 44% increase compared to the bookings of $174 million in the fourth quarter of 2022.

2023 年第四季調整後 EBITDA 為 1,950 萬美元，而 2022 年第四季為 2,100 萬美元。2023 年第四季的預訂量為 2.5 億美元，比 2022 年第四季的 1.74 億美元的預訂量增加了 44%。

I'll now turn to our cash flow, balance sheet and liquidity. We ended the year with total debt of $379.5 million and combined cash, cash equivalents and restricted cash balances of seven $71.3 million for a net debt of approximately $308.2 million.

現在我將談談我們的現金流、資產負債表和流動性。年底，我們的債務總額為 3.795 億美元，現金、現金等價物和限制性現金餘額合計為 7,130 萬美元，淨債務約為 3.082 億美元。

Additionally, as Kenny mentioned, subsequent to December 31st, 2023, we entered into a new three year senior secured credit agreement with Axis Bank under which accesses provided an asset base revolving credit facility of up to $150 million that can be used to support letters of credit for renewable energy growth initiatives and potential accretive businesses. The new revolver provides for reduced interest rates on letters of credit and much greater flexibility with overall use of up to $150 million versus the previous facilities that were limited to $50 million revolver and a separate letters of credit facility.

此外，正如肯尼所提到的，2023 年12 月31 日之後，我們與Axis 銀行簽訂了一項新的三年期高級擔保信貸協議，根據該協議，Accesses 提供高達1.5 億美元的資產基礎循環信貸便利，可用於支持再生能源成長措施和潛在增值業務的信用。新的循環信用證降低了信用證利率，並提供了更大的靈活性，總體使用量高達 1.5 億美元，而先前的信貸額度僅限於 5,000 萬美元的循環信貸額度和單獨的信用證額度。

The new financing arrangements have a maturity date of January 18th, 2027, and all obligations under the company's prior credit agreement with PNC Bank N.A., as administrative agent have been discharged, the credit agreement has also been terminated. Letters of credit issued under the previous facility with PNC are expected to transition to the access facility.

新融資安排的到期日為2027年1月18日，公司作為行政代理人與PNC Bank N.A.之前簽訂的信貸協議項下的所有義務均已解除，信貸協議也已終止。根據 PNC 之前的便利條件簽發的信用證預計將過渡到准入便利條件。

Over the next several months, we faced liquidity challenges arising primarily from losses recognized on our B&W solar loss contracts. We are actively evaluating certain actions to address our liquidity needs. Based on our ability to raise funds through such actions, we've concluded that it is probable that we will have sufficient capital to meet our operating debt service and capital requirements over the next 12 months.

在接下來的幾個月裡，我們面臨的流動性挑戰主要來自我們的 B&W 太陽能損失合約確認的損失。我們正在積極評估某些行動來滿足我們的流動性需求。根據我們透過此類行動籌集資金的能力，我們得出的結論是，我們很可能有足夠的資本來滿足未來 12 個月的營運償債和資本要求。

We expect 2024 quarterly profile to follow our normal cyclical performance of increasing profitability from the first quarter through the fourth quarter. As Kenny's highlighted, we're reiterating our 2024 target of between $100 million and $110 million of adjusted EBITDA, excluding bright loop in climate freight expenses and our confidence in an improved financial performance, underpinned by a robust pipeline of more than $9 billion of opportunities and expected backlog growth beginning in the first quarter of 2024.

我們預計 2024 年的季度概況將遵循我們從第一季到第四季獲利能力不斷提高的正常週期性表現。正如肯尼所強調的那樣，我們重申2024 年調整後EBITDA 為1 億至1.1 億美元的目標，不包括氣候貨運費用的明環以及我們對財務業績改善的信心，這得益於超過90 億美元的強勁機會預計積壓訂單將從 2024 年第一季開始成長。

I'll now turn the call back over to Ken.

我現在將把電話轉回給肯。

Thanks, Lou. That well briefly. In closing, our strategic business realignment is expected to drive predictable cash flow generation and provide higher margin performance across all business segments in 2020 for our deep industry expertise with clean energy and carbon capture technologies, coupled with our experience in traditional energy sources, it gives us a unique advantage in delivering sustainable solution to our customers and stakeholders as we move forward, we're both passionate and extremely enthusiastic about further developing our climate bright platform and the many opportunities ahead to deploy this innovative and game-changing technology at scale.

謝謝，盧。簡單說一下。最後，我們的策略性業務調整預計將推動可預測的現金流生成，並在2020 年為所有業務部門提供更高的利潤表現，因為我們在清潔能源和碳捕獲技術方面深厚的行業專業知識，再加上我們在傳統能源方面的經驗，隨著我們的前進，我們在為客戶和利益相關者提供可持續解決方案方面擁有獨特的優勢，我們對進一步開發我們的氣候明亮平台以及未來大規模部署這種創新和改變遊戲規則的技術的許多機會充滿熱情和極大的熱情。

As always, I want to express my gratitude to our employees around the world, our customers and shareholders and partners for the continued support and confidence in our company. We remain steadfast in our commitment to become a front runner in the global energy transition and continue to drive our strong profitable growth and create more sustainable energy for future generations to come.

一如既往，我要向我們世界各地的員工、客戶、股東和合作夥伴表示感謝，感謝他們對我們公司的持續支持和信心。我們堅定不移地致力於成為全球能源轉型的領跑者，並繼續推動我們強勁的獲利成長，為子孫後代創造更永續的能源。

So with that, Joe, I'll turn it back over to you for questions and answers.

因此，喬，我會將其轉回給您，以供您提問和解答。

Absolutely. We will now begin the question and answer session. (Operator Instructions)

絕對地。我們現在開始問答環節。（操作員說明）

Aaron Spychalla, Craig-Hallum.

亞倫·斯皮查拉，克雷格·哈勒姆。

Good afternoon, Kenny and Lou. Thanks for taking the questions.

下午好，肯尼和盧。感謝您提出問題。

Hey, thanks for joining.

嘿，感謝您的加入。

No problem. Yes, first question, you know, no noise on some of the large projects that you've been kind of talking about, you know, the bookings up in the fourth quarter. Did some of those hit in the fourth quarter?

沒問題。是的，第一個問題，你知道，你一直在談論的一些大型項目沒有任何噪音，你知道，第四季度的預訂量增加了。其中一些是在第四季發生的嗎？

And then maybe just some more details on what's to come. You called out a large gas conversion project here deal. Any kind of details on size and timing as we think about your confidence in the guide for this year?

然後也許只是關於即將發生的事情的更多細節。您在這裡提出了一個大型天然氣轉化專案的交易。考慮到您對今年指南的信心，有關於規模和時間安排的詳細資訊嗎？

Yes.

是的。

So we'll definitely announce more details around that project on Monday as we work through final disclosures and everything else around that specific project. But we're excited to announce that on Monday. And I think the important message on the timing of bookings on some of these projects which are sizable. The negotiations and other aspects took a little bit longer some of the other requirements to get those approved inside the customers took a little bit longer than anticipated. So we didn't quite hit the perfect timing of a Q4 booking versus a Q1 booking. But that's it helps to reiterate and stress that as we go into this year, we think we're going to I've one of the highest booking years we've had in recent history, and obviously, we're confident in that and underpinned by potentially some of the announcements on Monday as well as others that we're working on as well, too.

因此，我們肯定會在周一公佈有關該項目的更多細節，因為我們將完成最終披露以及有關該特定項目的其他所有內容。但我們很高興在周一宣布這一消息。我認為關於其中一些項目的預訂時間的重要資訊是相當大的。談判和其他方面花費的時間稍長一些，其他一些要求獲得客戶內部批准的時間比預期的要長一些。因此，我們並沒有達到第四季度預訂與第一季預訂的完美時機。但這有助於重申並強調，當我們進入今年時，我們認為我們將迎來近年來歷史上預訂量最高的年份之一，顯然，我們對此充滿信心，並且週一可能發布的一些公告以及我們正在處理的其他公告也為這一點提供了支撐。

All right. And then on the doubling of the FEED studies for carbon capture, you know, can you just kind of give some some quantification there, anything on timing as we kind of think about how those progress throughout the year and when we might see some contribution from those moving forward?

好的。然後，關於碳捕獲的 FEED 研究加倍，您知道，您能否給出一些量化數據，任何有關時間的信息，因為我們會考慮這些全年的進展情況以及何時我們可能會看到一些貢獻那些前進的人？

Yes. So we're excited about that because of the amount of FEED studies that we're getting in for us. And those are I mean, they're not material and revenues on an independent FEED study, but good margins for us on those, but they're developing those leading to further projects is obviously the most exciting part, and we do anticipate of that one or two of those would come to fruition in 24 from a project standpoint, not to get too far over the skis were in discussions on on one or the one, I guess one of those specifically right now about furthering that into a project aspects, there's a lot of approvals have to be done and so on so forth.

是的。因此，我們對此感到很興奮，因為我們正在進行大量的 FEED 研究。我的意思是，在獨立的FEED 研究中，它們並不是物質和收入，但對我們來說，這些利潤很高，但他們正在開發那些導致進一步項目的項目，這顯然是最令人興奮的部分，我們確實預計到這一點從項目的角度來看，其中一兩個將在24 小時內實現，不要在一個或一個的討論中超出滑雪板的範圍，我想其中一個現在特別是關於將其進一步推進到專案方面，有很多審批要做等等。

But we we're confident that hope that one of those will turn into a project this year, and that's why we mentioned that on the call itself, I hate to give any size on that yet because we're still going through negotiations and other aspects. But these would be very impactful projects for us, both on top line revenue and margins as well, but I'm probably more excited is that we fully anticipate getting one of these in we would actually be driving our carbon capture solutions to that utility commercial scale standpoint and this will still take one or two years to implement those projects over time, but getting the a few of these out the door to be very exciting for us.

但我們有信心，希望其中一個項目今年能夠成為一個項目，這就是為什麼我們在電話會議上提到，我不想透露任何規模，因為我們仍在進行談判和其他工作。方面。但這些對我們來說都是非常有影響力的項目，無論是在營收還是利潤方面，但我可能更興奮的是，我們完全預計其中一個項目的加入，我們實際上會將我們的碳捕獲解決方案推向公用事業商業從規模的角度來看，隨著時間的推移，這些項目的實施仍然需要一兩年的時間，但將其中一些項目推出對我們來說是非常令人興奮的。

So we're confident that will happen. I never say a perfect world. Obviously, we've got to get through negotiations and other aspects. Always something could happen. But and we're confident that we'll get to a conclusion and get one of those announced this year.

所以我們有信心這會發生。我從來沒有說過一個完美的世界。顯然，我們必須完成談判和其他方面的工作。總是有可能發生一些事情。但是我們有信心我們會得出結論並在今年宣布其中一項。

Good. And then just if I can sneak one more in just on free cash flow for 2024. Can you just kind of talk about the outlook there. You know, does that follow a similar cadence to the P&L for the for the rest of the year? And then just on the cost savings initiatives, just thinking about that as we think about cash flow?

好的。然後，如果我能在 2024 年的自由現金流上再增加一筆。能簡單談談那裡的前景嗎？你知道，今年剩餘時間的損益表是否遵循類似的節奏？然後只是關於成本節約計劃，就像我們考慮現金流一樣考慮這一點？

Yes, the cash flow does follow because as we've always talked about that, the cadence from Q1 to Q4 is very significant. Q1 for us is very low quarter. We come off strong. We always come off a strong fourth quarter because of the buying habits of many of our customers first quarter is much lower. Usually EBITDA will generally double in the second quarter and then increase each quarter from there and the cash flows will follow along with that Aaron.

是的，現金流確實隨之而來，因為正如我們一直在談論的那樣，從第一季到第四季的節奏非常重要。第一季對我們來說是非常低的季度。我們表現得很堅強。我們第四季總是表現強勁，因為第一季許多客戶的購買習慣要低得多。通常 EBITDA 一般會在第二季翻倍，然後每季都會增加，現金流也會隨之增加。

All right.

好的。

Thanks for the color. I'll turn it over.

謝謝你的顏色。我會把它翻過來。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Rob Brown, Lake Street Capital Markets.

羅布布朗，湖街資本市場。

Hey Kenny and Lou.

嘿肯尼和盧。

Hey, Rob.

嘿，羅布。

Um, on the on the thermal business, I think you talked about some some sort of strength or activity there. Could you give us a sense of how you expect that to grow? And then how you see the drivers coming in you?

嗯，關於熱力業務，我想你談到了那裡的某種力量或活動。您能否告訴我們您預計該業務將如何成長？那麼你如何看待司機的到來呢？

Well, so kind of, I guess, threefold on thermal, the parts and services business this year, we feel confident that it's a very strong position for U.S. MI.

嗯，我想今年的熱力、零件和服務業務成長了三倍，我們相信這對美國來說是一個非常有利的地位。米。

As we mentioned, a lot of these utility plants, in particular in the US, but obviously elsewhere in the world are under a lot of pressure to continue performing electrical demand in the U.S. reaching all-time highs right in the renewable aren't they are not necessarily in a position to catch up with the demand. So the some of these plants are have a lot of pressure to continue to perform. That helps on our parts and services platform. So we're optimistic about that. And see some of the early signs of that coming in 2024 already. So that's positive.

正如我們所提到的，許多公用事業工廠，特別是在美國，但顯然世界其他地方都面臨著繼續滿足美國電力需求的巨大壓力，在可再生能源方面達到了歷史最高水平，不是嗎？不一定能夠滿足需求。因此，其中一些工廠面臨著繼續運作的巨大壓力。這對我們的零件和服務平台很有幫助。所以我們對此持樂觀態度。2024 年，我們已經看到了一些早期跡象。所以這是積極的。

The other the other piece is we're seeing a large number of conversions of plants on gas conversions in particular are happening, and we're seeing a lot more of those opportunities. And we're in a much stronger position now to compete on those opportunities based on some of the acquisitions that we made and with some of the companies up in Canada and some of the companies in the US over the past couple of years that provides a greater capability for us around those gas conversions. And so we're in a much stronger place to compete on those. And we're excited about the number of opportunities that that continue to build for us and the pipeline. And obviously this project that we will announce on Monday as well so that we see those those gas conversions continuing.

另一件事是，我們看到大量工廠的改造，尤其是天然氣改造正在發生，我們看到了更多這樣的機會。基於過去幾年我們進行的一些收購以及與加拿大的一些公司和美國的一些公司的收購，我們現在處於更有利的地位，可以在這些機會上進行競爭，這些公司提供了我們在這些天然氣轉換方面的能力更強。因此，我們在這些方面處於更有利的競爭地位。我們對繼續為我們和管道創造的大量機會感到興奮。顯然，我們也將在周一宣布這個項目，以便我們看到這些天然氣轉換仍在繼續。

And as a result, our construction business. It is strong bookings this year will be strong for our construction business, which will flow into 25, 26 and a little bit into 27 as well for that from that standpoint. So we're excited about the pull through of some of these projects, not only for the parts and services aspect and the technology, but also for our construction business as well.

因此，我們的建築業務。今年的預訂量強勁，我們的建築業務也將強勁，從這個角度來看，我們的建築業務將流入 25、26 和一點點 27。因此，我們對其中一些項目的完成感到興奮，不僅是零件和服務方面以及技術，還有我們的建築業務。

So those combined are helping that's mainly North America-based, everything I described it to say how we've continued to expand our presence on thermal internationally, in particular, in Asia Pacific region, where the use of a lot of our technology from a parts and service standpoint continue to grow and we continue to expand with that. And so that's a positive, too.

因此，這些結合起來主要是為北美地區提供幫助，我所描述的一切都是為了說明我們如何繼續擴大我們在國際熱能領域的影響力，特別是在亞太地區，那裡使用了我們的許多技術零件和服務立場不斷增長，我們也隨之不斷擴展。所以這也是正面的。

So thermal, we do see that growing this year. I mean, we anticipate ENVIRONMENTAL continuing to perform extremely well this year.

如此熱，我們確實看到今年的成長。我的意思是，我們預計環境今年將繼續表現出色。

Overall from a growth standpoint, they said we strategically reset a little bit on renewable with trying to revamp waste energy into better projects for us in markets.

總體而言，從成長的角度來看，他們表示，我們在策略上對再生能源進行了一些調整，試圖將廢棄能源改造為市場上更好的項目。

And as I I mentioned in the remarks, we're actually seeing opportunities in the US in the Renewables segment for waste to energy.

正如我在演講中提到的，我們實際上在美國的可再生能源領域看到了廢物轉化能源的機會。

And we're very excited about those. And even though those would be probably projects that would if we're able to successfully win those would be more in 25 and 26. But we're seeing some real pipeline development around a number of different waste energy project here in the U.S., and that's an exciting development as we haven't talked about the US market on that in quite some time. So so that's I hope that helps, but that's how we see Thermo growing this year.

我們對此感到非常興奮。即使這些可能是項目，如果我們能夠成功贏得，那麼在 25 和 26 中會更多。但我們在美國看到了圍繞許多不同的廢物能源項目的一些真正的管道開發，這是一個令人興奮的發展，因為我們已經有一段時間沒有談論美國市場了。所以我希望這會有所幫助，但這就是我們看到 Thermo 今年成長的方式。

That's very helpful. Thank you. And then and just on the time line of sort of these strategic actions and I guess getting the solar business out and and changing over on the waste energy stuff. How is that sort of out of your numbers now? Or do you see that trailing down about 20 parts?

這非常有幫助。謝謝。然後，就在這些策略行動的時間線上，我想把太陽能業務拿出來，改變廢棄能源的情況。現在你的人數怎麼了？或者您是否看到了大約 20 個部分？

Well, we synergies is rendered a classified right so that's that's not in the U.S. I'm sorry that solar has been reclassified. So that's not in the numbers on from an adjusted EBITDA perspective on that particular piece. But we continue to drive that business.

好吧，我們的協同效應被賦予了分類權利，所以這不在美國。我很抱歉太陽能已被重新分類。因此，從該特定產品的調整後 EBITDA 角度來看，這並不在數字中。但我們將繼續推動這項業務。

Obviously, as we look at strategic options around the Solar platform and business, I think we announced a large project a not very long ago and on a series of projects that we're implementing now and we see the pipeline that we reported. 9 billion does not include solar because of reclassification, but we have a pipeline outside of that for solar that is sizable, and we see a number of opportunities expanding and growing around solar.

顯然，當我們考慮圍繞太陽能平台和業務的戰略選擇時，我認為我們不久前宣布了一個大型項目，以及我們現在正在實施的一系列項目，我們看到了我們報告的管道。由於重新分類，90 億美元不包括太陽能，但除了太陽能之外，我們還有一個相當大的管道，我們看到了許多圍繞太陽能擴展和增長的機會。

So you know that the team there is doing a great job of running that business and overall and delivering on those projects that we're winning today. And we'll where as we get past the prior projects that we had difficulties with and a lot of that is passionately coming to an end. We're excited to see what our Solar team is doing and will continue to perform on those opportunities as we look at the strategic options around that particular business.

所以你知道，那裡的團隊在業務運營和整體運營以及交付我們今天贏得的項目方面做得非常出色。當我們完成之前遇到困難的項目時，我們將在哪裡，其中許多項目即將結束。我們很高興看到我們的太陽能團隊正在做什麼，並將在我們考慮圍繞該特定業務的策略選擇時繼續抓住這些機會。

Yes, I think even though that business is in discontinued ops and it's reported separately, so you can see that the business that's not in discontinued ops as we've indicated we intend to sell that business. We're actively marketing it. But at the same time, we've got a team that's growing the business and that should create us more value with respect to a potential sale. So I don't want to give anybody the idea that we've abandoned that business because it's in discontinued ops, but also we do have the intent to continue to improve the business and therefore make it more valuable for us as we exit it and sell it.

是的，我認為即使該業務屬於停產業務，並且是單獨報告的，因此您可以看到該業務不屬於停產業務，因為我們已經表明我們打算出售該業務。我們正在積極行銷它。但同時，我們擁有一支正在發展業務的團隊，這應該為我們的潛在銷售創造更多價值。因此，我不想讓任何人認為我們已經放棄了該業務，因為它已停止運營，但我們確實有意圖繼續改進該業務，因此在我們退出時使其對我們更有價值賣掉它。

Great. Thanks for clarifying that. I'll turn it over.

偉大的。感謝您澄清這一點。我會把它翻過來。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Brent Thielman, D.A. Davidson.

布倫特·蒂爾曼，D.A.戴維森。

Thanks to you and getting the paper. And I guess maybe just turning to Turning back to the renewables business. I just wanted to get a better sense why the revenue was down so much sort of quarter on quarter and year on year, I thought Yes, work developing in Europe? And maybe it's maybe it's just a timing issue, but maybe just kind of clarify, what's that what's been happening in that business segment, obviously, ex solar?

謝謝你並得到了這篇論文。我想也許只是轉向再生能源業務。我只是想更了解為什麼收入環比和同比下降這麼多，我想是的，在歐洲發展工作？也許這只是一個時間問題，但也許只是澄清一下，該業務領域發生了什麼，顯然，前太陽能？

Yes. It's mainly timing. So we had a we had a number of projects, waste-to-energy projects and renewable in Europe.

是的。主要是時間安排。所以我們在歐洲有很多項目，包括垃圾發電和再生能源項目。

Some of those projects, a little bit lower margin. But as we completed those projects or some of those are nearing completion on out there, as we mentioned, so that when those projects start to slow down or get near the end, right, the revenue profile of those projects because we recognize revenue based on cost over time. So as they complete the revenue drops on it. So there's there's always the lumpiness and timing of new projects and contracts versus the completion of the other. At the same time, we also, as we announced in Q3, intently said, hey, we want to really focus more on selective opportunities and continue doing that, if you will. And there's there's a few projects out there that we're in discussions on right now that haven't reached a contract phase, but the opportunities are there and we're in discussions on those projects overall.

其中一些項目的利潤率略低。但是，正如我們所提到的，當我們完成這些項目或其中一些項目接近完成時，因此當這些項目開始放緩或接近結束時，這些項目的收入狀況，因為我們根據隨著時間的推移成本。因此，當他們完成時，收入就會下降。因此，新專案和合約與其他專案和合約的完成情況之間總是存在著間歇性和時間安排。同時，正如我們在第三季度宣布的那樣，我們也專心地說，嘿，我們希望真正更多地關注選擇性機會，並繼續這樣做，如果你願意的話。我們現在正在討論的一些項目尚未達到合約階段，但機會就在那裡，我們正在對這些項目進行整體討論。

So a little bit of a timing issue there quarter over quarter because we had a a large number of projects.

因此，每個季度都會出現一些時間問題，因為我們有大量的項目。

We were completing about the same time so that that impacted the revenue that the other aspect on renewable is in our services renewable services segment.

我們大約在同一時間完成，因此這影響了再生能源另一個方面在我們的服務再生服務部門的收入。

And we saw not hugely material yet to the top line revenue versus the project side of the business.

我們還沒有看到與業務項目方面相比的頂線收入的重大變化。

But we are seeing that business grow has similar margin characteristics as our thermal here in the US. So we should see that continue to perform very strong in 2024. We see nothing that tells us any different at this point in time.

但我們發現業務成長與我們在美國的熱電廠具有相似的利潤率特徵。因此，我們應該會看到 2024 年將繼續表現強勁。目前我們沒有看到任何不同的資訊。

I think we do see opportunities there that from 25 and 26. Renewable services will continue its growth year over year over year. I think that will be a very strong piece of business for us.

我認為我們確實看到了 25 歲和 26 歲的機會。再生能源服務將繼續逐年成長。我認為這對我們來說將是一項非常強大的業務。

And when we look out and mainly because of the number of upgrades and enhancements and the aging, if you will, of a lot of the waste-to-energy plants in Europe over there. And so similar to the U.S., there's there's advanced environmental pressures that go on those plants. And so those continue to have to be upgraded and enhanced the efficiency of the plants were out over time. So that impacts the overall performance of those plants need to be upgraded and enhanced. And we're continuing to be involved in many of those aspects on a number of those those plants in Europe on a renewable services standpoint. So we do see that business continuing to grow for us and it should become very material for us over the next couple of years.

當我們觀察時，主要是因為歐洲許多垃圾焚化發電廠的升級和增強數量以及老化（如果你願意的話）。與美國類似，這些工廠也面臨巨大的環境壓力。因此，隨著時間的推移，那些需要繼續升級並提高工廠效率的設備已經被淘汰。因此，這會影響那些需要升級和增強的工廠的整體性能。從再生服務的角度來看，我們將繼續參與歐洲許多工廠的許多方面。因此，我們確實看到我們的業務持續成長，並且在未來幾年內對我們來說應該變得非常重要。

Okay. Fair enough. And then I guess just in consideration of the liquidity position, obviously, you've made some moves to trying to address that, Lou, can you can you talk about free cash flow expectations for 2024 against the sort of guidance you've given for EBITDA? And I know you have some working capital requirements beginning of the year. I'd just be helpful to understand what kind of cash you think can come into the business this year?

好的。很公平。然後我想，考慮到流動性狀況，顯然，您已經採取了一些措施來試圖解決這個問題，Lou，您能根據您給出的指導來談談 2024 年的自由現金流預期嗎？息稅折舊攤銷前利潤？我知道你們在年初有一些營運資金需求。我只是想幫助您了解您認為今年可以進入該業務的現金類型是多少？

I think from an operating perspective will end up being slightly positive to a little better than slightly positive on an operating basis. As we talked about, we had liquidity issues. We've worked hard to put a plan in place to solve them and that plan has overcome. Those look should overcome those liquidity issues and for us on a much stronger footing from a balance sheet standpoint.

我認為從營運的角度來看，最終會比營運基礎上的稍微積極一點更好。正如我們所討論的，我們遇到了流動性問題。我們努力製定了解決這些問題的計劃，並且該計劃已經克服了。這些看起來應該可以克服這些流動性問題，並且從資產負債表的角度來看，我們的基礎更加牢固。

And then the again, the emphasis away from both the lower margin. And I want to I don't want to denigrate the new build business, but the lower margin, new build business uses a great deal of overhead as we've announced or taken 30. That's a de-emphasis of that is allowing us to take about $30 million the costs out of the business. And then we can concentrate on, as Kenny said, these higher margin renewable services businesses, which are in Europe, especially which are very much in line with the profit margins that we we generate on our United States thermal business. So from a cash flow standpoint, we think that's going to help us. I'm not ready to give a projection on cash flow at this point, Brent, because we've got a lot of moving parts. And we've got, as we said, we've got to work a plan that solves our other liquidity issues that arose primarily from the from those solar losses.

然後再一次，重點遠離了下邊距。我不想詆毀新建業務，但利潤較低的新建業務使用大量管理費用，正如我們已經宣布或採取的 30 項。這讓我們可以從業務中節省約 3000 萬美元的成本。然後，正如肯尼所說，我們可以專注於這些利潤率較高的再生能源服務業務，這些業務位於歐洲，特別是這些業務與我們在美國熱電業務中產生的利潤率非常一致。因此，從現金流的角度來看，我們認為這對我們有幫助。布倫特，我現在還沒準備好對現金流做出預測，因為我們有很多變動的部分。正如我們所說，我們必須制定一項計劃來解決主要由太陽能損失引起的其他流動性問題。

Got it. Okay. I'll get back in queue. Thanks.

知道了。好的。我會回到隊列中。謝謝。

Sure.

當然。

Thank you. (Operator Instructions)

謝謝。（操作員說明）

Alex Rygiel, B. Riley.

亞歷克斯·里吉爾，B.萊利。

Thank you. Good evening, Kenny and Lew. A couple of quick questions here. First, as it relates to the strategic realignment target 30 million, when do you think you're going to reach that? And is there any upside there?

謝謝。晚上好，肯尼和盧。這裡有幾個簡單的問題。第一，涉及3000萬的策略調整目標，您認為什麼時候能夠達到這個目標？這樣有什麼好處嗎？

There's always upside, Alex, but we'll we'll get to the I would get to the upside when we get to the upside from that front because we're always looking at how we optimize and reoptimize the business and make it more efficient from that standpoint. So there is potential upside on top of that 30 on that particular piece. But we I mean, by end of year and this year, I think we're through $19 million now, and I think we'd realize by end of year the full 13. That's part of the plan to get to the $100 million to $110 million of EBITDA that we've got as our target out there. So and on that. If we can get upside, obviously, we'll take advantage of that. But that's the plan right now.

總是有好處的，亞歷克斯，但我們會得到的，當我們從這方面得到好處時，我會得到好處，因為我們總是在考慮如何優化和重新優化業務並使其更加高效從這個角度來看。因此，除了這 30 個特定的部分之外，還有潛在的上漲空間。但我的意思是，到今年年底和今年，我認為我們現在已經完成了 1900 萬美元，而且我認為到年底我們將實現完整的 13 美元。這是我們實現 1 億至 1.1 億美元 EBITDA 目標的計畫的一部分。就這一點而言。如果我們能取得優勢，顯然我們會利用這一點。但這就是現在的計劃。

The other thing that does, Alex, as we as we deemphasize that business somewhat letters of credit. This can go down that substantially reduces our interest cost. So in addition to the $30 million that we're talking about there, there are other costs that will impact positively our cash flow. So I think I think it's a the strategic direction we're taking makes sense. It fits in line with our balance sheet and it fits in line with our emphasis on really part services that type that business and conversions rather than pure newbuilds that have just a low margin and high costs.

亞歷克斯，另一件事是，我們不強調信用證業務。這可以降低，從而大大降低我們的利息成本。因此，除了我們正在討論的 3000 萬美元之外，還有其他成本會對我們的現金流產生積極影響。所以我認為我們採取的策略方向是有意義的。它符合我們的資產負債表，也符合我們對真正的部分服務的重視，這些服務類型是業務和轉換，而不是利潤率低、成本高的純粹的新建建築。

And then as it relates to the discontinued solar business. Any update there on the timing of resolution of the outcome of it?

然後涉及已停止的太陽能業務。關於解決結果的時間有任何更新嗎？

No update on timing. We're actively in discussions and involved in conversations and the process but of note, no update on timing as of yet.

沒有更新時間。我們正在積極參與討論並參與對話和流程，但值得注意的是，目前還沒有具體時間的更新。

And lastly, as it relates to operate loop in Ohio, can you come back through and kind of update us on where we stand on that and what the time line looks like for construction to start and so on.

最後，由於它與俄亥俄州的營運循環有關，您能否回來向我們介紹我們在這方面的立場以及開始施工的時間線等等。

No, I appreciate that. So as we announced last quarter, and I think I reiterated in the remarks here, we have a letter of intent on the financing of that project. We are we have the location actually under contract right now for that site in Madison, which is good. And we're working through the permitting processes on that. The piece that the major piece that we're waiting on right now to complete, and we're going through internally on that is to come up and finalize the construction estimates. So we'll we'll utilize their both our our own internal boiler makers construction company, but we will also have a civil works partner on the civil works aspect, and we're trying to complete some of those estimates and based on that particular project. So as we continue to evolve that project, we continue to evolve the engineering side of it and the construction estimates, and we're waiting to get those complete and specifically a couple of long lead time items on the compression and compression technologies.

不，我很欣賞這一點。因此，正如我們上季度宣布的那樣，我想我在此處的發言中重申了這一點，我們就該項目的融資達成了一份意向書。我們現在實際上已經在麥迪遜的那個地點簽訂了合同，這很好。我們正在處理這方面的許可程序。我們現在正在等待完成的主要部分，我們正在內部進行的部分是提出並最終確定施工估算。So we'll we'll utilize their both our our own internal boiler makers construction company, but we will also have a civil works partner on the civil works aspect, and we're trying to complete some of those estimates and based on that particular專案.因此，當我們繼續發展該專案時，我們將繼續發展其工程方面和施工估算，並且我們正在等待完成這些工作，特別是關於壓縮和壓縮技術的幾個較長交付週期的專案。

We're also trying to get as we look at finalizing that project to make sure that we're in sync with our offtake partner, both for the hydrogen and CO2 and in this particular case, we believe that the CO2 would be beverage grade rather than sequestering CO2.

當我們考慮最終確定該項目時，我們還試圖確保我們與承購合作夥伴在氫氣和二氧化碳方面保持同步，在這種特殊情況下，我們相信二氧化碳將是飲料級而不是飲料級。比封存二氧化碳。

And that's added a little bit of complexity, not much pretty standard off-the-shelf technology, but added a little bit of complexity on the layout of that project and therefore, some consideration on some of the civil construction elements that we need to finalize. So once we get through that particular piece, we need to see where we are specifically on the gap between the financing we have and the final construction price and work through any of those final issues there and then we would look to to move forward with that project and begin the construction.

這增加了一點複雜性，沒有太多標準的現成技術，但增加了這個專案佈局的一點複雜性，因此，需要考慮一些我們需要最終確定的土木建築元素。因此，一旦我們完成了這一特定部分，我們需要了解我們所擁有的融資與最終建築價格之間的具體差距，並解決其中的任何最終問題，然後我們將期待繼續推進這項工作項目並開始施工。

So little bit loose on specific timing as we were trying to complete some some of those elements and finalize that and worked through some of those details, but we'll keep everybody apprised as we move along.

當我們試圖完成其中一些要素並最終確定並完成其中一些細節時，具體時間安排有點鬆散，但我們會在進展過程中隨時向大家通報情況。

And then lastly, congratulations on the $16 million grant. Can you talk about maybe some of the other applications that you have in for other grant money and what the time lines of those could look like?

最後，恭喜您獲得 1600 萬美元的資助。您能否談談您正在申請的其他撥款以及這些申請的時間表？

Yes.

是的。

We are working, obviously with one or two other states, I won't go too much further than that, but because we're under NDA, but we are working with one or two other states on some funding capabilities around additional brightly projects within those states. And so we're we're progressing and moving those discussions and dialogue along, and obviously, we'd announce that as soon as practical, we are working aggressively with of the Department of Energy on a few different opportunities to help fund some of this technology.

我們正在與其他一兩個州合作，我不會比這走得更遠，但因為我們處於保密協議之下，但我們正在與其他一兩個州合作，圍繞境內其他明亮項目提供一些融資能力那些州。因此，我們正在取得進展並推動這些討論和對話，顯然，我們會宣布，一旦可行，我們正在與能源部積極合作，尋找一些不同的機會來幫助資助一些這項技術。

One of a couple of areas. Obviously, some combinations of the Department of Energy loan program, looking at also the possibilities of some other funding within it, some other departments in the federal government to support and the implementation of these projects and we're working on that as well.

幾個區域之一。顯然，能源部貸款計劃的一些組合，同時也在考慮其中其他一些資​​金的可能性，聯邦政府的一些其他部門支持和實施這些項目，我們也在努力。

The other key piece, I think as a reminder, I think we've announced or discussed it last year, but we do have appropriations language that was a bipartisan approved and signed into law by the President last year for appropriations funding of the commercialization efforts, chemical looping to hydrogen production from biomass, coal and natural gas. And we're in a lot of discussions there with state officials as well as federal officials to trying to push that through and move that along. So we are continuing those efforts rigorously here in Washington DC to trying to get that moved Ford as well, too.

另一個關鍵部分，我想提醒一下，我想我們去年已經宣布或討論過它，但我們確實有兩黨批准的撥款語言，並於去年由總統簽署成為法律，為商業化工作提供撥款，化學循環從生物質、煤炭和天然氣生產氫氣。我們正在與州官員以及聯邦官員進行大量討論，試圖推動並推動這項進程。因此，我們將在華盛頓特區繼續努力，努力讓福特也能做到這一點。

Perfect. Thank you very much.

完美的。非常感謝。

There are no additional questions in queue. I'd like I turn the call back over to Sharyn Brooks for concluding remarks.

隊列中沒有其他問題。我想將電話轉回莎琳布魯克斯 (Sharyn Brooks) 進行總結發言。

Thanks, everyone, for joining us today. This concludes our conference call. A replay will be available for a limited time on our website later today.

謝謝大家今天加入我們。我們的電話會議到此結束。今天晚些時候，我們的網站將在有限時間內提供重播。

That concludes today's conference call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect your lines.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。現在您可以斷開線路。