Axos Financial, Inc. (AX) 2026 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the Axos fourth-quarter 2026 earnings conference call webcast. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference is being recorded.

各位好，歡迎收看 Axos 2026 會計年度第四季財報電話會議網路直播。(接線員指示) 提醒各位，本次會議將被錄音。

I would now like to turn the conference over to Johnny Lai, SVP, Corporate Development and IR. Thank you, Johnny. You may begin.

現在我想將會議交給企業發展與投資人關係資深副總裁 Johnny Lai。謝謝你，Johnny。你可以開始了。

Thanks, Alicia. Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to our fourth-quarter 2026 earnings conference call. Joining us today are the company's President and Chief Executive Officer, Greg Garrabrants; and Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer, Derrick Walsh. Greg and Derrick will review and comment on the financial and operational results for the quarter and fiscal year ended June 30, 2026, and we will be available to answer questions after the prepared remarks.

謝謝你，Alicia。各位下午好，歡迎參加我們 2026 會計年度第四季財報電話會議。今天與會的有公司總裁兼執行長 Greg Garrabrants，以及執行副總裁兼財務長 Derrick Walsh。Greg 與 Derrick 將回顧並評論截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日之季度與會計年度的財務與營運結果；在預先準備的發言結束後，我們也將回答各位的提問。

Before I begin, I would like to remind listeners that prepared remarks made on this call may contain forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties and that management may make additional forward-looking statements in response to your questions. Please refer to the Safe Harbor statement found in today's earnings press release and in our investor presentation.

在我開始之前，我想提醒各位，本次電話會議中的預先準備發言可能包含前瞻性陳述，並受風險與不確定性影響；管理層也可能在回覆各位問題時提出額外的前瞻性陳述。請參閱今日財報新聞稿及我們投資人簡報中的「安全港」聲明。

This call is being webcast, and there will be an audio replay available in the IR section of the company's website located at axosfinancial.com for 30 days. Details for this call were provided on the conference call announcement and in today's earnings press release.

本次電話會議將進行網路直播，並將在公司網站 axosfinancial.com 的投資人關係（IR）專區提供音訊重播，為期 30 天。本次電話會議的相關細節已於電話會議公告及今日財報新聞稿中提供。

Now, I'd like to turn it over to Greg for opening remarks.

現在，我想把時間交給 Greg 進行開場致詞。

Thank you, Johnny. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us. I'd like to welcome everyone to Axos Financial's fiscal 2026 earnings conference call for the quarter ended June 30, 2026. I thank you for your interest in Axos Financial.

謝謝你，Johnny。各位下午好，感謝各位加入我們。歡迎各位參加 Axos Financial 截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日季度的 2026 會計年度財報電話會議。感謝各位對 Axos Financial 的關注。

We closed our fiscal 2026 with positive momentum with double-digit year-over-year growth in net interest income, noninterest income, ending loan and deposits, EPS and book value per share. We generated approximately $638 million of net loan growth linked quarter, resulting in a 15% annualized growth in net income. Excluding single-family mortgage warehouse, ending net loan balances increased by $750 million from March 31, 2026 to June 30, 2026. Otherwise highlights in the quarter include noninterest income was $61.9 million for the quarter ended June 30, 2026, up from $41.3 million in the corresponding quarter a year ago.

我們以正向動能結束 2026 會計年度，淨利息收入、非利息收入、期末貸款與存款、每股盈餘（EPS）以及每股帳面價值皆呈現年增雙位數成長。本季我們的淨貸款較前一季增加約 6.38 億美元，折算為淨收益年化成長 15%。若排除單戶住宅房貸倉儲業務，期末淨貸款餘額自 2026 年 3 月 31 日至 2026 年 6 月 30 日增加 7.5 億美元。本季其他重點包括：截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止季度的非利息收入為 6,190 萬美元，高於去年同期的 4,130 萬美元。

For the 12 months ended June 30, 2026, noninterest income was $233.6 million compared to $131.1 million in fiscal year 2025. The primary contributor to the year-over-year growth in noninterest income for the 3 and 12-month period were Verdant, prepayment fees and the additional rental income from the commercial office building we purchased in January 2026 to be used as our future headquarters.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止 12 個月，非利息收入為 2.336 億美元，相較 2025 會計年度的 1.311 億美元。非利息收入在 3 個月與 12 個月期間的年增主要貢獻來源為 Verdant、提前清償費，以及我們於 2026 年 1 月購入、作為未來總部之商用辦公大樓所帶來的額外租金收入。

Net interest margin was 4.54% for the quarter ended June 30, 2026, roughly flat compared to 4.57% in the prior quarter. Excluding the impact from holding higher average cash balances and the addition of deposits acquired from Jenius Bank, our net interest margin was up slightly quarter-over-quarter.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止季度的淨利息收益率（NIM）為 4.54%，與前一季的 4.57% 大致持平。若排除持有較高平均現金餘額的影響，以及併入自 Jenius Bank 收購之存款，我們的淨利息收益率較前一季略有上升。

Noninterest expenses were $205.9 million for the three months ended June 30, 2026, up by $20 million linked quarter. Excluding the $21 million accrual related to a legal matter in our clearing business, noninterest expenses were down $1 million linked quarter due to lower advertising, promotion, professional services and other G&A expenses. We continue to maintain a low operating efficiency ratio despite ongoing investments in product, technology and people. Our bank efficiency ratio was 42.2% for the 12 months ended June 30, 2026, compared to 40.8% in the fiscal year 2025.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月，非利息費用為 2.059 億美元，較前一季增加 2,000 萬美元。若排除我們清算業務中一項法律案件相關的 2,100 萬美元應計費用，非利息費用較前一季減少 100 萬美元，主要因廣告、促銷、專業服務及其他一般與管理（G&A）費用降低。儘管我們持續投資於產品、科技與人才，我們仍維持較低的營運效率比率。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止 12 個月，我們的銀行效率比率為 42.2%，相較 2025 會計年度的 40.8%。

Nonperforming assets were $159 million at June 30, 2026, down from $180 million at March 31, 2026, and $175 million at June 30, 2025. We remain well reserved relative to our low current and historic level of net charge-offs with an allowance for credit losses to total loans of 1.34% at June 30, 2026.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日，不良資產為 1.59 億美元，低於 2026 年 3 月 31 日的 1.80 億美元，以及 2025 年 6 月 30 日的 1.75 億美元。相較於我們目前及歷史上偏低的淨沖銷水準，我們的備抵仍相當充足；截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日，信用損失準備金占總貸款比率為 1.34%。

Net income was approximately $124.9 million in the quarter ended June 30, 2026, up 12.9% from the $110.7 million in the prior year's fourth quarter. Diluted EPS was $2.16 per share for the quarter ended June 30, 2026, compared to $1.92 per share in the fourth quarter of fiscal 2025, representing a 12.5% year-over-year increase. Excluding the $21 million legal accrual, net income was $141.8 million and diluted earnings per share was $2.46 for the three months ended June 30, 2026, up 28% from the prior year's comparable quarter.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止季度，淨利約為 1.249 億美元，較去年第四季的 1.107 億美元成長 12.9%。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止季度，稀釋後每股盈餘為 2.16 美元，相較 2025 會計年度第四季的 1.92 美元，年增 12.5%。若排除 2,100 萬美元的法律應計費用，截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月的淨利為 1.418 億美元，稀釋後每股盈餘為 2.46 美元，較去年同期成長 28%。

We repurchased $22 million of common stock during the three months ended June 30, 2026, at an average price of $87.95 per share. We have approximately $126 million remaining in our current share repurchase authorization. Total originations for investment, excluding single-family warehouse lending, increased 22% on a linked-quarter basis, resulting in ending net loan growth of approximately $750 million. Loan growth was strong in capital call, real estate lender finance, floor plan lending and equipment finance. Jumbo single-family, multifamily and small balance commercial loan balances were roughly flat linked quarter.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月，我們以每股平均 87.95 美元的價格回購了 2,200 萬美元的普通股。在目前的股票回購授權下，我們尚餘約 1.26 億美元的可回購額度。投資用放款的總承作量（不含單戶住宅倉儲放款）較前一季增加 22%，帶動期末淨貸款成長約 7.5 億美元。資本催繳（capital call）、不動產放款機構融資、車商庫存融資（floor plan lending）及設備融資的貸款成長強勁。巨額（jumbo）單戶住宅、多戶住宅以及小額商用貸款餘額較前一季大致持平。

Average loan yields for the three months ended June 30, 2026, were 7.4%, stable compared to the prior quarter. Average loan yields for nonpurchased loans were 7.2% and average yields for purchased loans was 13%, which includes the accretion of our purchase price discount. The FDIC purchased loans continue to perform and all loans in that portfolio remain current.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月，平均貸款收益率為 7.4%，與前一季持平。非收購貸款的平均收益率為 7.2%，收購貸款的平均收益率為 13%，其中包含收購價折價的攤提增益（accretion）。FDIC 收購貸款持續表現良好，該投資組合中的所有貸款目前皆維持正常（current）。

New loan rates for the June quarter were 6.9% in our single-family mortgage business, 6.8% in multifamily, 6.6% in C&I lending and 7.8% in our auto portfolio. Ending deposit balances of $24.6 billion were up 17.9% year-over-year. Demand, money market and savings accounts represent 98% of total deposits as of June 30, 2026, increasing by 22% year-over-year.

6 月季度的新承作貸款利率：單戶住宅房貸業務為 6.9%，多戶住宅為 6.8%，工商貸款（C&I）為 6.6%，汽車貸款投資組合為 7.8%。期末存款餘額為 246 億美元，年增 17.9%。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日，活期、貨幣市場與儲蓄存款占總存款的 98%，年增 22%。

We have a diverse mix of funding across a variety of business verticals with consumer and small business representing 57% of total deposits, commercial cash, treasury management and institutional representing 20%, commercial specialty representing 14%, Axos Fiduciary Services representing 5% and Axos Securities also representing 5%.

我們在多元業務垂直領域擁有多樣化的資金來源組合：消費者與小型企業占總存款 57%；商業現金管理、財資管理與機構客戶占 20%；商業專業領域占 14%；Axos 受託服務（Axos Fiduciary Services）占 5%；Axos 證券（Axos Securities）亦占 5%。

We closed the Jenius deposit acquisition in early May 2026, adding approximately $2.3 billion of deposit balances and over 56,000 consumer savings accounts. We have been successful in cross-selling checking accounts to Jenius customers so far, adding over 3,400 new Axos consumer checking accounts in the few months since we onboarded these Jenius customers to UDB.

我們於 2026 年 5 月上旬完成 Jenius 存款收購案，新增約 23 億美元的存款餘額以及超過 56,000 個消費者儲蓄帳戶。截至目前，我們在向 Jenius 客戶交叉銷售支票帳戶方面成效良好，自將這些 Jenius 客戶導入 UDB 以來的數個月內，已新增超過 3,400 個新的 Axos 消費者支票帳戶。

Ending noninterest-bearing deposits increased by $439 million linked quarter and $788 million year-over-year to over $3.8 billion as of June 30, 2026. The linked quarter and year-over-year increase in noninterest-bearing deposits is a result of growth in Axos Clearing and Axos Advisory Services cash suite deposits, increased cross-sell from certain commercial lending businesses and growth in our small business deposits.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日，期末無息存款較上一季增加 4.39 億美元，較去年同期增加 7.88 億美元，達到逾 38 億美元。無息存款的季增與年增主要來自 Axos Clearing 與 Axos Advisory Services 現金套組存款成長、特定商業放款業務帶動的交叉銷售增加，以及我們小型企業存款的成長。

Client cash sorting deposits ended the quarter around $1.2 billion, up from $1.1 billion at March 31, 2026. In addition to our securities deposits on balance sheet, we had approximately $475 million of deposits off balance sheet at partner banks. We remain focused on adding noninterest-bearing deposits from small business, custody clearing, fiduciary services and commercial and treasury cash management verticals.

客戶現金分揀（cash sorting）存款於本季末約為 12 億美元，高於 2026 年 3 月 31 日的 11 億美元。除資產負債表上的證券相關存款外，我們在合作銀行的表外存款約為 4.75 億美元。我們仍聚焦於自小型企業、託管清算、信託服務，以及商業與財資現金管理等垂直領域增加無息存款。

Our fund finance business had another strong quarter, contributing over $600 million of net new loan growth in the June quarter. We continue to identify opportunities to deepen our relationships with existing fund finance partners as well as add new fund relationships. Our diverse product and service offerings in commercial cash and treasury management have enabled us to capture low-cost deposits through the fund finance vertical. The growth in our vendor ecosystem continues to gain momentum.

我們的基金融資（fund finance）業務本季再度表現強勁，在 6 月季度貢獻超過 6 億美元的淨新增放款成長。我們持續尋找機會深化與既有基金融資合作夥伴的關係，同時新增基金合作關係。我們在商業現金與財資管理方面多元的產品與服務，使我們能透過基金融資垂直領域取得低成本存款。我們供應商生態系的成長動能持續加速。

The Verdant Equipment Finance and non-marine floor plan lending teams actively collaborate on a variety of retail and wholesale lending opportunities. Both teams are leveraging their expertise and relationships across their vendor and dealer networks to gain share of wallet and to provide a more seamless and differentiated set of lending solutions to our vendor partners. The floor plan lending business had its strongest quarter to date, growing outstanding loans by over $100 million in the three months ended June 30, 2026.

Verdant 設備融資與非船舶（non-marine）庫存融資（floor plan lending）團隊正積極合作，開拓多元的零售與批發放款機會。兩個團隊皆運用其專業與在供應商及經銷商網路中的關係，以提升客戶錢包占比（share of wallet），並為我們的供應商合作夥伴提供更無縫且差異化的放款解決方案組合。庫存融資業務創下迄今最強勁的一季，在截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日的三個月內，未償放款增加超過 1 億美元。

Demand in our commercial specialty real estate fund finance, real estate lender finance and asset-based lending businesses remained strong. Pipelines are up across several lending categories, making us confident that we will generate loan growth in the low to mid-teens on an annual basis this year.

我們在商業專業不動產基金融資、不動產放款機構融資，以及資產擔保放款（asset-based lending）業務的需求仍然強勁。多個放款類別的案源管線（pipeline）均有所增加，使我們有信心今年可在年度基礎上達成低至中十位數百分比的放款成長。

The credit quality of our loan book remains strong, and our historical and current net charge-offs remain low. Net charge-offs were 25 basis points in the quarter ended June 30, 2026, compared to 31 basis points in the prior quarter. We charged off the remaining $10 million of our principal balance in the syndicated C&I cash loan that was put on nonaccrual over a year ago. Excluding the credit charge-off related to that loan, total net charge-offs were $5.9 million in the three months ended June 30, 2026, or 9 basis points of net annualized charge-offs to average loans.

我們放款組合的信用品質仍然強健，歷史與目前的淨核銷（net charge-offs）水準皆維持偏低。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止季度的淨核銷為 25 個基點，較前一季的 31 個基點下降。我們已將一筆於一年多前轉列為停計息（nonaccrual）的聯貸 C&I 現金貸款之剩餘 1,000 萬美元本金餘額全數核銷。若排除該筆貸款相關的信用核銷，截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月的淨核銷合計為 590 萬美元，或相當於平均放款的年化淨核銷 9 個基點。

Total nonperforming assets were $159 million at June 30, 2026, down approximately $23 million from $180 million at March 31, 2026. Nonperforming assets declined by approximately $21 million in C&I lending and held roughly flat across most other lending categories. Nonaccruals and classified assets remain low across the majority of our real estate backed and structured credits. Total nonperforming assets to total assets was 53 basis points, down 9 basis points from March 31, 2026, and down 18 basis points from June 30, 2025.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日，不良資產總額為 1.59 億美元，較 2026 年 3 月 31 日的 1.80 億美元減少約 2,300 萬美元。不良資產在 C&I 放款方面減少約 2,100 萬美元，而其他多數放款類別大致持平。在我們多數以不動產作為擔保及結構性授信中，停計息與列管資產（classified assets）水準仍偏低。不良資產占總資產比率為 53 個基點，較 2026 年 3 月 31 日下降 9 個基點，亦較 2025 年 6 月 30 日下降 18 個基點。

We remain well reserved for our low level of credit losses with our allowance for credit loss to nonaccrual loans equal to 221% at June 30, 2026. We had another quarter of double-digit year-over-year growth in noninterest income. Total noninterest income for the three months ended June 30, 2026, was $61.9 million, up 50% year-over-year. Banking and service fees in Q4 of 2026 were $36.8 million compared to $9.5 million in the year ago quarter. Verdant was the primary contributor to the year-over-year increase in banking and service fees.

就我們偏低的信用損失水準而言，我們的備抵提列仍相當充足；截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日，信用損失備抵（allowance for credit loss）對停計息放款之比率為 221%。我們非利息收入年增再度達到雙位數成長。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月的非利息收入總額為 6,190 萬美元，年增 50%。2026 年第 4 季的銀行與服務費為 3,680 萬美元，較去年同期的 950 萬美元大幅增加。Verdant 是銀行與服務費年增的主要貢獻來源。

Prepayment penalty fees were $4.2 million compared to $0.2 million in Q4 2025. In Axos Clearing, advisory and broker fees were up year-over-year due to higher asset and transaction-based income. Total assets under custody administration increased by $8.4 billion year-over-year to $47.8 billion. Net new assets were approximately $85 million in the quarter ended June 30, 2026, bringing the net new asset totaled to $2.2 billion for fiscal year 2026.

提前清償違約金（prepayment penalty）收入為 420 萬美元，較 2025 年第 4 季的 20 萬美元增加。在 Axos Clearing 方面，顧問與經紀費用因資產與交易型收入較高而較去年同期成長。託管管理資產總額（assets under custody administration）較去年同期增加 84 億美元至 478 億美元。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止季度的淨新增資產約為 8,500 萬美元，使 2026 會計年度的淨新增資產累計達 22 億美元。

Cash sorting deposits on and off balance sheet increased by over $100 million linked quarter to $1.67 billion. Ending margin balances were up 36% from the prior fiscal year. Pretax income in fiscal 2026 was $15.4 million on a reported basis and $36.4 million, excluding the $21 million legal accrual in the 12 months ended June 30, 2026, versus $32 million in fiscal year 2025.

資產負債表內外的現金分揀（cash sorting）存款較上一季增加逾 1 億美元至 16.7 億美元。期末融資融券（margin）餘額較前一會計年度增加 36%。2026 會計年度稅前盈餘按申報口徑為 1,540 萬美元；若排除截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止 12 個月內提列的 2,100 萬美元法律準備，稅前盈餘為 3,640 萬美元，相較 2025 會計年度的 3,200 萬美元。

We continue to manage our noninterest expense while making investments across existing and new businesses as well as technology and other infrastructure to support future growth across our three business segments. Total noninterest expense for the three months ended June 30, 2026, were $205.9 million, representing an efficiency ratio of 54.2%. Excluding the $21 million legal accrual and depreciation and amortization expenses, noninterest expenses were $158.1 million, equating to an efficiency ratio of 41.6%, down by 283 basis points from 44.5% in Q4 2025.

我們在持續管理非利息費用的同時，也在既有與新業務，以及科技與其他基礎設施方面進行投資，以支持三大業務部門未來的成長。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月的非利息費用總額為 2.059 億美元，效率比率為 54.2%。若排除 2,100 萬美元法律準備以及折舊與攤銷費用，非利息費用為 1.581 億美元，效率比率為 41.6%，較 2025 年第 4 季的 44.5% 下降 283 個基點。

We continue to evaluate and execute opportunistic and strategic mergers and acquisitions transactions. So far in calendar 2026, we've announced three separate deposit-related acquisitions, including Jenius Bank in February, Capital One in April and Arc Technologies in July. Jenius Bank closed in May, adding approximately $2.3 billion of online savings in over 56,000 accounts. We received regulatory approval for the Capital One IRA savings and CD acquisition in May and are actively working with Capital One on a conversion and a close date in calendar -- in Q3 2026.

我們持續評估並執行具機會性與策略性的併購交易。截至目前在 2026 年曆年內，我們已宣布三項不同的存款相關收購案，包括 2 月的 Jenius Bank、4 月的 Capital One，以及 7 月的 Arc Technologies。Jenius Bank 已於 5 月完成交割，新增約 23 億美元的線上儲蓄存款，分布於超過 56,000 個帳戶。我們已於 5 月取得 Capital One IRA 儲蓄與定期存單（CD）收購案的監管核准，並正與 Capital One 積極推進轉換作業與交割日期，預計於曆年—在 2026 年第 3 季完成。

We closed the Arc Technologies transaction a few weeks ago. Arc Technologies is a fintech that developed a cash management and debt marketplace technology for businesses. We believe Arc service offers a gap -- offering fills a gap for a segment of businesses previously underserved by Axos that value an AI-enabled digital treasury management solution and access to a wide range of potential lenders. Furthermore, we believe we can leverage the technology and third-party integrations and entitlements Arc has built as a foundation for other consumer and commercial banking services to accelerate our strategic road map.

我們於數週前完成 Arc Technologies 交易。Arc Technologies 是一家金融科技公司，為企業開發現金管理與債務市場（debt marketplace）技術。我們認為 Arc 的服務填補了一項缺口——其產品可滿足先前未被 Axos 充分服務的一部分企業客群；這些企業重視 AI 驅動的數位財資管理解決方案，以及接觸廣泛潛在放款人的能力。此外，我們相信可運用 Arc 所建構的技術、第三方整合與權限架構，作為其他消費金融與商業銀行服務的基礎，以加速我們的策略路線圖。

We are adding a team of talented product, sales and software engineers who will help us accelerate these development efforts. The initial focus will be to integrate Arc into our banking platform to serve our tens of thousands of existing small business clients. We see tremendous opportunities to better serve our existing clients, cross-sell consumer clients with small businesses and accelerate growth in new business banking segments such as early-stage start-ups.

我們正在增聘一支由優秀的產品、銷售與軟體工程師組成的團隊，以協助我們加速這些開發工作。初期重點將是把 Arc 整合進我們的銀行平台，以服務我們現有數以萬計的小型企業客戶。我們看到龐大的機會，能更好地服務既有客戶、將消費者客戶與小型企業進行交叉銷售，並加速在新興商業銀行細分領域（例如早期新創公司）的成長。

By leveraging one set of technologies and entitlements across the full spectrum of the client's life cycles from start-up to a mature small business to a middle market company and beyond, we believe we'll be able to attract, retain and grow with our clients.

透過在客戶生命週期的完整光譜（從新創、成熟的小型企業到中型市場公司及更往後）運用同一套技術與權限配置，我們相信將能吸引客戶、留住客戶，並與客戶一同成長。

Our ability to generate above-industry returns and growth provide us with multiple opportunities to deploy excess capital. In the past 12 months, we funded over $3.5 billion of organic loan growth, added roughly $1.2 billion in leases and on-balance sheet securitizations from Verdant, closed the Jenius Bank and Arc Technologies acquisition and repurchased approximately $22 million of Axos common stock.

我們創造高於同業的報酬與成長的能力，為我們提供多種部署多餘資本的機會。在過去 12 個月中，我們支持了超過 35 億美元的有機貸款成長，新增約 12 億美元來自 Verdant 的租賃與表內證券化，完成 Jenius Bank 與 Arc Technologies 的收購，並回購約 2,200 萬美元的 Axos 普通股。

We remain highly profitable, generating a return on assets of 1.76% and a return on average common stockholders' equity of 16.32% in the 12 months ended June 30, 2026. Excluding the $21 million legal accrual, our return on assets and return on equity would have been 1.92% and 17.82% this quarter and 1.82% and 16.86% for the fiscal year. We continue to be nimble and opportunistic in deploying our excess capital where we see superior risk-adjusted returns.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止的 12 個月內，我們仍維持高度獲利，資產報酬率（ROA）為 1.76%，平均普通股股東權益報酬率（ROE）為 16.32%。若排除 2,100 萬美元的法律準備金，本季的 ROA 與 ROE 將分別為 1.92% 與 17.82%，而本會計年度則分別為 1.82% 與 16.86%。我們持續保持靈活並把握機會，在我們看到具備更佳風險調整後報酬之處部署多餘資本。

Now I'll turn the call over to Derrick, who will provide additional details on our financial results.

接下來我把電話會議交給 Derrick，他將提供我們財務結果的更多細節。

Thanks, Doug. A quick reminder that in addition to our press release, an 8-K with supplemental schedules was filed with the SEC today and is available online through EDGAR or through our website at axosfinancial.com. I will provide some brief comments on a few topics. Please refer to our press release and our SEC filings for additional details.

謝謝，Doug。簡短提醒：除新聞稿外，我們今天也向 SEC 提交了附有補充明細表的 8-K，並可透過 EDGAR 或我們的網站 axosfinancial.com 線上查閱。我將就幾個主題做一些簡要說明。更多細節請參閱我們的新聞稿與向 SEC 提交的文件。

Noninterest expenses were approximately $206 million for the three months ended June 30, 2026, up by $20 million from $186 million in the three months ended March 31, 2026. Salaries and benefit expenses were up $1.1 million linked quarter and professional service fees were down $1.5 million. FDIC and regulatory fees were also down $1.3 million quarter-over-quarter. Excluding the $21 million legal accrual, noninterest expenses in the three months ended June 30, 2026, were down by approximately $1 million linked quarter.

截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月的非利息費用約為 2.06 億美元，較截至 2026 年 3 月 31 日止三個月的 1.86 億美元增加 2,000 萬美元。薪資與福利費用較上季增加 110 萬美元，而專業服務費用較上季減少 150 萬美元。FDIC 與監管費用亦較上季減少 130 萬美元。若排除 2,100 萬美元的法律準備金，截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月的非利息費用較上季約減少 100 萬美元。

Across our noninterest expense categories, we continue to see some of the benefits from operational productivity initiatives, including the increased leverage of AI tools that we have implemented over the past 12 months. Looking ahead, as we integrate Arc Technologies, we expect our noninterest expense run rate to increase by approximately $1 million per month.

在各項非利息費用類別中，我們持續看到營運生產力計畫帶來的一些效益，包括我們在過去 12 個月導入的 AI 工具所帶來的槓桿效益提升。展望未來，隨著我們整合 Arc Technologies，我們預期非利息費用的常態化支出水準將每月增加約 100 萬美元。

Turning to income taxes. Our income tax rate was 19.9% in the three months ended June 30, 2026, compared to 24.6% in the prior quarter. The primary reason for the sequential decline in our income tax rate was benefits from restricted stock unit vestings and a favorable change in state taxes and certain discrete items.

接著談所得稅。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日止三個月，我們的所得稅率為 19.9%，相較前一季為 24.6%。所得稅率季對季下降的主要原因，是受限制性股票單位（RSU）歸屬帶來的稅務利益，以及州稅的有利變動與若干一次性項目。

While we continue to explore tax credit opportunities that could provide future tax rate benefits, our expectation is to maintain an annual tax rate of approximately 26% to 27%, excluding such potential benefits. Provision for credit losses was $17.8 million in Q4 2026 compared to $41 million in Q3 2026. The primary driver for the quarter-over-quarter decrease in provision for credit losses was a less severe economic outlook and a minor shift of credit model scenario weightings towards baseline. We expect to maintain a loan loss reserve of approximately 1.3% to 1.4% of total loans and leases going forward.

雖然我們持續探索可在未來帶來稅率效益的稅額抵減機會，但在不含此類潛在效益的情況下，我們預期全年稅率約維持在 26% 至 27%。2026 會計年度第四季的信用損失準備為 1,780 萬美元，較 2026 會計年度第三季的 4,100 萬美元下降。信用損失準備季對季下降的主要驅動因素，是經濟展望較不嚴峻，以及信用模型情境權重略微向基準情境移動。展望未來，我們預期將把貸款損失準備金維持在總貸款與租賃的約 1.3% 至 1.4%。

I'll wrap up with our loan pipeline and growth outlook. Our loan pipeline is robust at approximately $2.4 billion as of June 30, 2026, consisting of $637 million of SFR jumbo mortgage, $50 million of gain on sale mortgage, $92 million of multifamily and small business commercial, $68 million of auto and consumer and $1.6 billion across the commercial business lines.

最後我以我們的貸款案源（pipeline）與成長展望作結。截至 2026 年 6 月 30 日，我們的貸款案源強勁，約為 24 億美元，其中包括 6.37 億美元的 SFR 巨額房貸、5,000 萬美元的出售收益型房貸、9,200 萬美元的多戶住宅與小型企業商業貸款、6,800 萬美元的汽車與消費貸款，以及商業業務線合計 16 億美元。

We expect broad-based growth across several lending businesses to drive low to mid-teen organic loan growth in the next year, excluding any potential acquisitions. We deployed some of the Jenius Bank deposits to reduce temporary increases in FHLB borrowings this past quarter and plan to use the remaining Jenius Bank deposits in combination with growth in our consumer and commercial banking deposits to fund our strong loan growth.

在不包含任何潛在併購的情況下，我們預期多項放款業務的廣泛成長將帶動未來一年有機貸款成長達低到中十位數百分比。本季我們動用部分 Jenius Bank 存款，以降低 FHLB 借款的短期增加；並計畫將剩餘的 Jenius Bank 存款，結合我們消費與商業銀行存款的成長，用於支應我們強勁的貸款成長。

With that, I'll turn the call back over to Johnny.

接下來我把電話會議交回給 Johnny。

Thanks, Derrick. Alicia, we're ready to take questions.

謝謝，Derrick。Alicia，我們準備開始提問。

(Operator Instructions) David Chiaverini, Jefferies.

（接線員指示）David Chiaverini，Jefferies。

I wanted to start on the net interest margin. How should we think about the NIM outlook from here? And can you also touch upon your expectations on deposit costs going forward?

我想先從淨利差（NIM）談起。我們應該如何看待接下來的 NIM 展望？也請談談你們對未來存款成本的預期。

Yes. So we believe we'll have a fairly stable net interest margin outlook. And we also think that, that's going to be with fairly stable deposit costs. Now, we obviously have the acquisition from Capital One coming, and there are some deposits that will eventually flow over from Arc because those deposits are controlled by Arc, but are placed at other financial institutions. So we just -- I think the best forecast is relative stability there. And I think that's a reasonable outlook for that.

是的。我們認為淨利差展望將相當穩定。我們也認為存款成本將相對穩定。當然，我們即將完成來自 Capital One 的收購，且未來會有一些存款從 Arc 轉入，因為那些存款由 Arc 控制，但目前放在其他金融機構。因此我們只是——我認為最好的預測就是相對穩定。我認為這是合理的展望。

Got it. And are you observing any increase because you guys are one of the highest growth banks in my coverage, which is great to see. Are you seeing increased competitiveness on the deposit side as you go to market?

了解。另外，你們是我覆蓋範圍內成長最快的銀行之一，這很令人欣喜。當你們走向市場時，在存款端是否觀察到競爭加劇？

I don't know if I'd say increased competitiveness from recent periods. I do think that what you're seeing is that other banks are more willing to adopt a model where they, let's say, bring a companion high-cost savings account and a small business checking account together where that might not have been something you'd see a branch-based bank do, you might see some of them doing that now.

我不確定是否能說相較近期有競爭加劇。但我確實認為你看到的是，其他銀行更願意採用一種模式：例如把一個配套的高成本儲蓄帳戶與小型企業支票帳戶一起推出；這可能不是你會在以分行為主的銀行看到的做法，但現在你可能會看到其中一些銀行開始這麼做。

So I do think, obviously, that we've been able to raise the deposits we need to continue to grow our business, but we continue to be focused on it across a variety of different verticals that we continue to add and products we continue to develop. So I don't know if I'd say there's broad-based increase in competition. I just think we are seeing a few folks that it appears that they're having trouble raising deposits, and so they are being maybe a little more aggressive.

所以我認為，很明顯地，我們一直能夠募集到持續成長業務所需的存款，但我們仍在多個不同垂直領域上持續聚焦，同時也持續新增與開發產品。因此我不確定是否能說競爭出現全面性增加。我只是覺得我們看到少數同業似乎在吸收存款方面遇到困難，所以他們可能會更積極一些。

Kyle Peterson, Needham & Company.

Kyle Peterson，Needham & Company。

I want to start off on loan growth. Great to see the outlook for another strong year. Just wanted to get a sense or any more color if you guys have it on kind of where you guys see the most opportunity or if there's any areas that are giving you maybe a sense of pause just if there's structural issues or competition or people getting too aggressive. So I guess like maybe areas on the asset side where you're more or less excited in the coming year would be helpful.

我想先從放款成長談起。很高興看到你們對於再迎來強勁一年的展望。我想了解一下，你們認為最大的機會會在哪些地方，或是否有任何領域讓你們稍微有些猶豫——例如結構性問題、競爭，或是市場參與者變得過於積極。所以我想，若能分享一下明年在資產端哪些領域你們比較看好、哪些比較不那麼看好，會很有幫助。

Yes, it's a good question. I think that given the diversity of our lending businesses, in any one quarter, just the timing of getting deals closed, the pipelines may move around a little bit. But I think we'll have relatively balanced growth across our C&I platform. And I feel like there's -- there may be -- maybe there's some pullback in private credit in certain areas, but I don't really think that's going to translate into a lot of new opportunity for us because I think those credits were sort of outside the box and they may have to adjust more.

是的，這是個好問題。我認為，鑑於我們放款業務的多元性，在任何一個季度，單就交易結案時點而言，管線可能會有些波動。但我認為我們在商業與工業（C&I）平台上的成長會相對均衡。我覺得——某些領域的私募信貸可能會有些退縮，但我不太認為這會轉化為我們大量的新機會，因為我認為那些信貸本來就有點超出常規，他們可能需要做更多調整。

But that might be something that's a positive in certain cases because I do think that there is some pullback in private credit in certain areas. We've seen a few deals in our lender finance book that people were threatening maybe to leave because they were going to get higher advance rates from a private credit shop, and then that didn't come to fruition. So there's a little bit there that I think in some cases, maybe private credit will be less likely to be able to take some of our assets because we have great originations. For us, it's always the prepay side that we really have to pay attention to.

不過在某些情況下，這可能是正面的，因為我確實認為私募信貸在某些領域有些退縮。我們在放款人融資（lender finance）業務中看到幾筆交易，對方原本威脅要離開，因為他們打算從某家私募信貸機構拿到更高的預支比率（advance rates），但最後並沒有實現。所以我認為在某些情況下會有一點這樣的機會：私募信貸可能比較不容易把我們的一些資產拿走，因為我們的承作來源（originations）很強。對我們而言，我們真正必須留意的永遠是提前清償（prepay）那一端。

So I think it's really pretty balanced growth. We -- I think the most credit-sensitive segment that we're in, which we have to be very thoughtful about is just the direct lending to sponsor-backed companies. And to the extent we've had any kind of losses at Axos, which have been relatively rare, it has been in syndicated loans to -- single asset syndicated loans to companies that go through some sort of issue that there's not diversity in a pool and that kind of thing or hard collateral like we have with most of our loans. So that might be an area. I think it is an area that you have to just be cautious about and think through, make sure the documents are in good shape with respect to LME transactions, things like that.

所以我認為整體來說成長相當均衡。我們——我認為我們所處的、對信用最敏感的區塊，是我們必須非常審慎看待的：也就是對由贊助商支持（sponsor-backed）的公司進行直接放款。而就 Axos 而言，若我們曾出現任何損失（相對少見），多半發生在聯貸——對單一資產的聯貸——當公司遇到某種問題時，因為不像我們大多數放款那樣有資產池的分散性，或有強而有力的抵押品（hard collateral）。所以那可能是一個領域。我認為那是你必須保持謹慎並仔細推敲的領域，確保文件條款在面對 LME 交易等事項時是健全的。

Great. That's super helpful. And then I wanted to switch over and maybe ask a higher-level question on Arc. It seems like a really interesting acquisition and a good fit. But I wanted to see if you could give us a little more color. I know you guys have said kind of immaterial to results, but just how it expands the product offering, monetization and whether that is helping with deposit growth and fee income, I guess like how do you see that playing out over the long term once it's integrated and onboarded onto the broader platform?

很好。這非常有幫助。接著我想切換一下，問一個關於 Arc 的較高層次問題。看起來這是一筆很有意思、也很契合的收購。但我想看看你們能否再多提供一些細節。我知道你們說過對業績影響不大，但它如何擴展產品供給、變現（monetization），以及是否有助於存款成長與手續費收入——也就是說，一旦整合完成並導入到更大的平台後，長期來看你們認為會如何發展？

Yes. Kyle, I'm glad to get a chance to talk about that because I wanted to do that. So if you think about where we currently sit right now technologically, we've been opening thousands of small business accounts a month. But the reality of that small business platform is its capacity is limited. It sort of was derived from the consumer platform, and then we added the ability to have checks and debit cards and have essentially an account that is a small business account, but it has features that are similar to the consumer business.

是的。Kyle，我很高興有機會談這個，因為我也一直想談。如果你想想我們目前在科技面的位置，我們每個月都在開立數千個小型企業帳戶。但小型企業平台的現實是，它的容量有限。它某種程度上是從消費者平台衍生而來，然後我們加上支票與簽帳金融卡等功能，讓它本質上成為小型企業帳戶，但其功能仍與消費金融業務相近。

On the other side, we have a very sophisticated treasury management platform with a service offering where folks go through an extensive onboarding process, entitlements process for all their employees, all these other kind of things, and you can do whatever you need to do there even if you're quite a large company. We bank some large companies as their primary bank, and they're able to do a lot. We benchmark ourselves not without any gap, but those gaps are relatively limited even with the larger money center banks.

另一方面，我們有一個非常成熟的資金管理（treasury management）平台與服務方案，客戶需要經過相當完整的導入流程、為所有員工設定權限（entitlements）的流程，以及各種其他事項；即使你是一家相當大型的公司，也能在那裡完成你需要做的一切。我們為一些大型公司提供主要往來銀行服務，他們能做很多事情。我們拿自己去對標大型貨幣中心銀行（money center banks），雖然不是完全沒有差距，但差距相對有限。

But in that really squishy middle, there's a lot of small businesses that outgrow us, and they tell us when they leave. They say, look, we really like you guys, but I've got three employees now. I need each of them to have a debit card. I need some form of positive pay because I want to let those employees write checks, but I don't want those employees to have access to an unlimited amount of the account. I need incremental fraud protections, things like that. And that's where Arc comes in. I want an expense management platform, something like a ramp has or something like that.

但在那個相當模糊的中間地帶，有很多小型企業會成長到超出我們目前能服務的範圍，而且他們離開時會告訴我們原因。他們會說：你們真的很好，但我現在有三名員工了。我需要每個人都有一張簽帳金融卡。我需要某種形式的正向支付（positive pay），因為我想讓員工可以開支票，但我不希望員工能不受限制地動用帳戶資金。我需要額外的防詐保護之類的功能。而這就是 Arc 派上用場的地方。我想要一個費用管理平台，像 Ramp 那樣的東西或類似方案。

So that's really where Arc comes in. Arc has essentially created a very sophisticated digital platform for start-up businesses and even businesses that are middle market that might have a very specific set of use cases that are maybe -- you might call them TM Lite. But frankly, Arc, it's even better than TM Lite. It's full TM. It doesn't -- it may not have certain features and functionality that our broadest platform has.

所以 Arc 真正切入的就是這裡。Arc 基本上為新創企業，甚至是中型市場（middle market）企業，打造了一個非常成熟的數位平台；這些企業可能有一組非常特定的使用情境，你或許會稱之為「TM Lite」。但坦白說，Arc 甚至比 TM Lite 更好。它是完整的資金管理（full TM）。只是它可能沒有我們最完整平台所具備的某些功能與特性。

So we believe that by taking our existing small business clients -- and I'm sorry, there seems to be some noise on here, I don't know. Taking some small business clients and bringing those clients on to Arc, we're going to be able to expand the offering to those clients because they often have other banks that they're using for their more sophisticated services and keep those clients longer.

所以我們相信，透過把我們既有的小型企業客戶——抱歉，這裡好像有些雜音，我不太確定——把部分小型企業客戶導入 Arc，我們將能擴大對這些客戶的服務內容，因為他們往往會另外使用其他銀行來取得更進階的服務；而這也能讓我們把客戶留得更久。

Now Arc does have an existing client base of Y combinator companies that we're excited to serve, and we think we have other opportunities to serve those clients and grow with them through our technology business. But -- so that's one area. Arc also has been a leader in thinking through how the front-facing, consumer-facing or client-facing side of AI works. And we've done a lot on the AI front internally focused on improving internal operations and all those sorts of things. But we haven't yet had a product that we roll out to clients that will allow them to use artificial intelligence.

另外，Arc 也有一個既有的客戶基礎，包含 Y Combinator 的公司，我們很期待為他們提供服務；而且我們認為，透過我們的科技業務，還有其他機會能服務這些客戶並與他們一同成長。不過——所以這是一個面向。Arc 也一直走在前面，思考 AI 在前台、面向消費者或客戶端的運作方式。而我們在 AI 方面也做了很多，主要是內部導向，用於改善內部營運與各類流程。但我們尚未推出一個能讓客戶使用人工智慧的產品。

And Arc has really figured that out and has done it really well for small business clients. And they've done that through a set of very interesting integrations and then creation of specific agents that are very useful for a small business to run themselves. So that is a broader capability set that we believe we have to really start thinking about for our consumer, small business clients and even our larger commercial clients.

而 Arc 真的把這件事想清楚了，並且為小型企業客戶做得非常好。他們透過一系列非常有意思的整合，並打造特定的代理（agents），讓小型企業在經營管理上非常實用。因此，這是一套更廣泛的能力組合；我們相信，對於我們的消費者、小型企業客戶，甚至更大型的商業客戶，我們都必須開始認真思考如何導入這些能力。

So -- and then the final element is that one of the things that's really helped us grow and scale without having to add a lot of costs on the consumer side is that we control the entire user experience. And that user experience control allows us to really analyze all kinds of inbound calls, allows us to just create workflows that automate certain processes and things. And it's allowed us to really, if we look at it, more than grow our deposit base more than 7 times and barely add any new people to that consumer deposit operations process.

所以——最後一個要素是，真正幫助我們在不必在消費者端增加大量成本的情況下成長並擴張的一點，是我們掌控了整個使用者體驗。而對使用者體驗的掌控，讓我們能夠深入分析各式各樣的來電，也讓我們能建立工作流程，把某些流程與事項自動化。這也讓我們能夠——如果你看結果——存款基礎成長超過 7 倍，但在消費者存款營運流程上幾乎沒有新增任何人力。

We don't have the ability to do that on the commercial side because right now, we don't own all that technology. So although we use great technology there, and it's working, we just switched to a new platform that was top upper right, Gartner Group and whatnot. It's all third party. And so here, this will gradually allow us to develop and utilize a lot of the services that we have in our consumer business. For example, we're rolling out crypto payments, right, in consumer. But that same set of rails may be useful for commercial clients, but Arc can just sort of incorporate that into their platform over time, utilizing all the services that Axos has.

在商業端我們做不到這點，因為目前我們並不擁有所有那套技術。所以即便我們在那邊使用的是很好的技術，而且運作良好，我們也才剛切換到一個新平台——在 Gartner Group 的象限圖上位於右上角之類的。但那全部都是第三方的。因此，這裡將會逐步讓我們能夠開發並運用許多我們在消費金融業務中已有的服務。例如，我們正在消費端推出加密貨幣支付，對吧。但同一套支付軌道（rails）也可能對商業客戶有用，而 Arc 可以隨時間把它整合進他們的平台，運用 Axos 所提供的所有服務。

So I think it's a really good fit. And we have so much traction on the small business side that it really is difficult to get that really digital TM style lite experience and get it at a reasonable cost in an automated way. So I think there's a lot here. We've got to get on it. And there are some fees that are generated from it.

所以我認為這是非常契合的。而且我們在小型企業端的動能非常強，要以合理成本、用自動化方式，提供那種真正數位化、偏 TM 風格的精簡體驗，確實很難做到。所以我覺得這裡面有很多機會。我們得趕快推進。而且這也會產生一些費用收入。

I think Derrick is being a CFO and sandbagging a little bit. But I think right now, they weren't profitable. So although they are generating fees. And when we move the deposits over, they'll be more benefit than there is cost, but that's going to take a little time because we actually have to integrate their platform into all our APIs. And so we just closed them a couple of weeks ago. We're working on the time frame for that, but we don't quite have it ironed out yet. They believe it's going to be relatively easy, but we want to just make sure that it is, in fact, as fast as the team thinks they can do it.

我覺得 Derrick 以 CFO 的身分有點保守（sandbagging）了。但我認為就目前而言，他們當時並不獲利。所以雖然他們確實有產生費用收入。而當我們把存款移轉過來後，效益會大於成本，但這需要一點時間，因為我們實際上必須把他們的平台整合進我們所有的 API。而且我們是幾週前才完成交割。我們正在規劃時程，但目前還沒有完全敲定。他們認為會相對容易，但我們想確認實際上確實能像團隊認為的那樣快速完成。

David Feaster, Raymond James.

David Feaster，Raymond James。

Let's start on -- I mean, look, you guys have been extremely active, right? You got 3 deposit-focused deals in the past six months. How -- like how has the integration and conversion been of all these? I mean that's a lot at one time. And I guess, like how have you been able to maybe deploy AI to help you with the integration and conversion? And then what's your appetite for additional deals given all that you've already got going on?

我們先從——我是說，你們最近真的非常積極，對吧？過去六個月你們做了 3 筆以存款為主的交易。這些交易的整合與轉換進展如何——我是說，同一時間做這麼多。這真的很多。我想問的是，你們如何運用 AI 來協助整合與轉換？另外，考量你們手上已經在進行的這些事情，你們對於再做更多交易的胃納（appetite）如何？

Yes. Well, these deals -- well, there are deals different, but let's just talk about the Jenius and Cap One deals. We've done so many of these just straight raw, no asset deposit deals that the team really has a playbook down. So I have to say that I expected them to do well on Jenius side, but they just did fabulously. I mean, like the number of accounts that were lost, they actually were essentially de minimis.

是的。嗯，這些交易——交易各有不同，但我們先談 Jenius 和 Cap One 這兩筆。我們做過非常多這種純粹、沒有資產、只收存款的交易，團隊其實已經有一套很成熟的作業手冊（playbook）。所以我得說，我原本就預期他們在 Jenius 這邊會做得不錯，但他們表現得非常出色。我是說，流失的帳戶數其實基本上微不足道（de minimis）。

They were next to nothing. There was almost no client complaints. Most -- everybody pretty much stayed. We grew the deposit balances subsequent to that. We got great penetration on -- we had a checking account offer that we -- because Jenius didn't have that, that we had as a companion.

幾乎等於沒有。客戶抱怨幾乎沒有。大多數——幾乎所有人都留下來了。在那之後我們的存款餘額還持續成長。我們在——我們推出了一個支票帳戶方案——因為 Jenius 沒有這個，我們把它作為搭配產品。

So as clients first logged in, they could click a button and get a checking account. Many of them did do that, and we're still seeing traction there. So that was really smooth.

所以客戶第一次登入時，他們可以按一個按鈕就開立支票帳戶。很多人確實這麼做了，而且我們仍然看到那邊持續有動能。所以整個過程非常順暢。

And then given that scalability that we had talked about previously through the platform, there really wasn't -- we were able to -- we did deploy some additional folks in our offshore locations and staff those up like we had done previously, but the calls quickly dissipated because the onboarding was smooth, and it really was very easy and almost kind of a nonevent, frankly. All with a lot of accounts, we're growing a lot every month anyway. So it wasn't -- it was obviously a little bit of a shock, but not much. I think similarly, Capital One should be similar because it's straightforward in the sense it's just a deposit-only acquisition.

再加上我們先前談到的平台可擴展性，其實並沒有——我們確實像以前一樣，在海外據點增派了一些人手並把編制補起來，但因為導入（onboarding）很順，來電很快就消退了；坦白說，整件事非常容易，幾乎像是沒發生什麼事。而且我們本來每個月就有很多帳戶、也一直在成長。所以——當然一開始有點衝擊，但不算大。我認為 Capital One 也會類似，因為它很直接，本質上就是一筆僅存款的收購。

And then obviously, we didn't get any people although we hired a few Jenius bank people who were floating around the market who wanted to come to us, and they are good folks, and we're happy to have them. But we didn't have any people come with that. Arc was different in the sense that it was a fintech that we hired teams. They have a unique capability, and that capability now has to be integrated into our UDB platform essentially.

然後很明顯地，我們沒有接收任何人員，雖然我們確實聘了幾位當時在市場上流動、想加入我們的 Jenius 銀行員工；他們都很優秀，我們也很高興有他們加入。但那筆交易並沒有任何人員隨之移轉過來。Arc 則不同，因為它是一家金融科技公司，我們是把團隊一起聘進來。他們有一項獨特能力，而這項能力現在基本上必須整合進我們的 UDB 平台。

And so there's a little trickiness associated with that because we were like this thing like we're putting in a slider, so you could be on your consumer and small business and you just pull it over like Uber Eats and Uber Ride and then you'd be able to have everything. And we've got to think about how all that works. And so there's some tech stuff. But the team is great. They're super entrepreneurial.

所以這裡會有一點棘手，因為我們想像的是做一個像滑桿一樣的東西，讓你在消費者與小型企業之間切換——你就像 Uber Eats 和 Uber Ride 那樣把它滑過去——然後你就能擁有所有功能。我們得思考這整套要怎麼運作。所以會有一些技術面的事情。但團隊很棒。他們非常有創業精神。

And we just have so much stuff going on in the tech side that we need that we had a bunch of recs open for people that we were going to essentially hire who were like that. Like we needed somebody who was going to do consumer and client-facing AI work, and now we have somebody.

而且我們在技術端同時有太多事情在推進，我們原本就開了很多職缺（recs），打算去找那種特質的人來聘用。例如我們需要一位能做消費者端與客戶介面 AI 工作的人，而現在我們已經有了。

So that was really good. I think the tech there is going to put us ahead in our goal of building the platform and building up our small business platform. And then there is -- there are deposits that come with that, but they also did something where they took some of those excess deposits and pushed them into treasuries, and we're charging a fee. So we have to kind of work that. So there's a little bit of integration there. But I don't think it's not going to be overwhelming, particularly given all the tech stuff we have going on here.

所以這真的很好。我認為那邊的技術會讓我們在打造平台、以及強化我們的小型企業平台這個目標上更領先。另外——也會帶來一些存款，但他們也做了一件事：把部分多餘存款轉去買美國公債（treasuries），而我們會收取一筆費用。所以我們得把這部分理順。因此整合上會有一點工作。但我不認為會難以負荷，尤其考量我們這邊正在進行的各種技術工作。

So essentially, we believe we're still open for acquisition business. We did Verdant, of course, too, which was a little bit later, but that also has gone very well. So I think if you get the right fit with the teams, then it really works pretty well. So yes, so we're very open. We continue to look. And we think there's a lot of opportunity. We've done a lot of -- I think we -- I sort of feel like we're trying to -- we punch above our weight given our size with the diversity of what we do and the amount of time and effort we spend on building our own technology. And there's lots of banks that are bigger than ours that don't do that, but the technology is very scalable. So the ability to integrate like we did with Jenius and what we'll do with the Cap One side, really doesn't move the needle much on cost.

所以本質上，我們認為我們仍然對併購業務保持開放。當然我們也做了 Verdant，那是稍晚一些，但進展也非常順利。所以我認為，只要團隊之間契合度對了，事情就會運作得相當好。所以是的，我們非常開放。我們會持續尋找。而且我們認為機會很多。我們做了很多——我想我們——我某種程度覺得，以我們的規模來看，憑藉我們所做事情的多元性，以及我們在自建技術上投入的時間與精力，我們其實是「以小搏大」。有很多比我們更大的銀行並沒有這麼做，但這套技術的可擴展性非常高。因此，像我們與 Jenius 的整合，以及我們接下來會在 Cap One 那一側做的整合，在成本上其實不太會造成明顯影響。

And I think we've seen that from a standpoint of just some of that noninterest expense being more flat. It's AI, but it's also just scalability across platforms because we have a certain number of platforms. We're spending money on them, and they can take a lot more volume through them without too much incremental cost. I don't know if that's what you're getting at, but there's any follow-up you want --

而且我認為我們也從某些非利息費用相對持平的角度看到了這一點。這裡有 AI 的因素，但也包括跨平台的可擴展性，因為我們的平台數量是固定的。我們在這些平台上投入資金，而它們可以承載更大的業務量，卻不需要太多的邊際新增成本。我不確定這是不是你想問的重點，但如果你還有任何後續問題想追問--

No, that's super helpful. And then just based on your prepared remarks, it sounds like Verdant and the Marine business really starting to hit stride, collaborating. I was hoping you could elaborate a bit on what you're seeing from those two lines and whether any of these new businesses can help with the expansion or cross-sell. Just based on your comments, it sounds like Arc might be an opportunity to help those business lines, but just kind of curious what you're seeing there.

不，這非常有幫助。然後根據你準備好的發言內容，聽起來 Verdant 和 Marine 業務真的開始步入正軌、並且在協作。我想請你再多談一點，你從這兩條業務線看到的情況，以及這些新業務是否能協助擴張或交叉銷售。就你剛才的評論來看，Arc 似乎可能是一個能幫助這些業務線的機會，但我只是想了解你目前看到的狀況。

Yes. That's -- yes, it's a very interesting question. Let's start with the lending side first. So the Verdant side, obviously, you're financing individual clients, businesses of vendors that come in and buy equipment. And so those tend to be smaller ticket, but they're very valuable for the vendor because obviously, if they can't sell their product, that's a problem to them.

是的。這——是的，這是個非常有意思的問題。我們先從放款端談起。就 Verdant 這一端而言，很明顯你是在為個別客戶、以及進來購買設備的供應商之企業客戶提供融資。因此單筆金額通常較小，但對供應商來說非常有價值，因為很顯然，如果他們賣不出產品，對他們就是個問題。

Verdant has a nice white label platform that allows the vendors to have their name on the paper and things like that, which is not completely unique, but if you do it well. And then also, there's a capital markets test that also allows us to sell paper to nonbank lenders. So that allows Verdant to have a higher approval rate, which is important, obviously, for vendors who are trying to sell to clients that are not going to be happy if they get turned down to be able to buy something.

Verdant 有一個不錯的白標平台，讓供應商可以把自己的名稱放在文件上之類的；這並非完全獨一無二，但關鍵在於你是否做得好。另外，還有一個資本市場的測試機制，也讓我們能把票據（paper）賣給非銀行放款人。這使得 Verdant 能有更高的核准率；這點對供應商很重要，因為他們要賣給客戶，而客戶如果被拒絕、無法購買，當然不會高興。

So then conversely, we brought that floor plan team on. And the Verdant team because they have so many salespeople, I mean, they're the biggest sales force we have by far. They're out there talking to all these vendors who also need floor plan because they're going to sell their switches, but they also need floor plan them. So that is generating good results because there's a pipeline for the floor plan side driven by what Verdant does.

然後反過來說，我們把那個庫存融資（floor plan）團隊納入了。而 Verdant 團隊因為有非常多的業務人員——我的意思是，他們是我們目前為止規模最大的銷售團隊。他們在外面跟這些供應商洽談，而這些供應商除了要賣他們的設備之外，也需要庫存融資，因為他們要備貨、要把貨「放在地上」。所以這帶來了不錯的成果，因為庫存融資端的案源管道，是由 Verdant 的業務所驅動的。

Now on the deposit side, we have seen some success there with just working with some of these vendors on their banking arrangements. Certainly, if you've got their floor plan, you're often getting their operating accounts. But I do think there is an opportunity there. We've put some metrics in the Verdant sales team's plans to cross-sell and that sort of thing. But it's much easier to sell the actual vendor themselves on banking if you're doing that floor plan than if -- than trying to actually say that you're going to cross-sell deposits to the end client who buys that equipment.

再來看存款端，我們也看到一些成功案例，主要是與這些供應商在其銀行往來安排上合作。當然，如果你做了他們的庫存融資，通常也會拿到他們的營運帳戶。但我確實認為這裡還有機會。我們已經在 Verdant 銷售團隊的獎酬方案裡放入一些交叉銷售等指標。不過，如果你在做庫存融資，要把供應商本身的銀行業務賣給他們，會比——比起試圖對最終購買設備的終端客戶交叉銷售存款要容易得多。

Now that might be something we can do, but I think that's a little more pioneering. But if what happens is when that client logs in and they're logging in from a servicing perspective, which isn't the way it's happening now into, let's say, the Arc platform that is then providing them AI-oriented information and things like that, and they could just sort of click to open the deposit account with some special offer, I think I could eventually see that working.

那當然也可能是我們可以做的事，但我認為那會更偏向開創性的做法。不過如果未來的情況是，當那位客戶登入時，他是從服務（servicing）的角度登入——目前還不是這樣——例如登入到 Arc 平台，而平台提供 AI 導向的資訊等內容，然後他可以直接點一下，用某個特別優惠就開立存款帳戶，我想我最終是可以想像這會行得通。

Frankly, right now, Verdant stuff is serviced to a third party. So there's a lot of work that has to be done there. So that's not as a near term an opportunity as some of the other stuff we're doing. But I do see it as like you touch us, we can bring you into a platform and cross-sell you. I do think there's an opportunity there. But I think this historic platform integrated is special. I mean it does some really neat stuff, and they just didn't have the funding to be able to get it out to as many folks as we are going to be able to do.

坦白說，目前 Verdant 的相關服務是外包給第三方在做。所以那裡還有很多工作要完成。因此，這不像我們正在做的其他一些事情那樣，是一個短期內的機會。但我確實認為這有點像：只要你接觸到我們，我們就能把你帶進一個平台並對你做交叉銷售。我確實認為那裡有機會。而且我認為這個歷史平台的整合是很特別的。我的意思是，它能做一些非常巧妙的事情，只是他們過去沒有資金把它推廣到像我們接下來能觸及的那麼多人。

That's helpful. And then you talked about most of the credit issues that you've had in the past have been really related to SNCs. Philosophically, I guess, how do you think about SNCs just given that experience? What's your appetite for those today? And is there a need for you to continue to do those?

這很有幫助。然後你提到，你們過去大多數的信用問題其實都與 SNC 有關。從理念上來說，我想問的是，基於那段經驗，你現在如何看待 SNC？你們目前對這類業務的承作意願（appetite）如何？而且你們是否仍有必要繼續做這類業務？

Or is there opportunity for you to maybe agent more of those deals just given a more active approach to managing the relationship and credit?

或者，考量到你們對關係與信用管理採取更積極的方式，你們是否有機會在更多這類交易中擔任主辦行（agent）？

Yes, we're trying to do that. And we're definitely being more careful about the agents that we choose and looking for philosophical alignment, maybe looking for some more club deals. I think it's interesting because there's a -- I think broadly syndicated stuff, I think, definitely is becoming much and much less interesting. As you get smaller because we do have a syndication desk now, and we have folks that are willing to allow us to agent deals, but there is something around this question of if you get a company that's of a small enough size that you're holding the entire loan and it still is a -- whether it's sponsor-backed or family-owned or whatnot, and it's still a single enterprise that is subject to the faith of the economy and obsolescence of product and customer concentration and all the things that exist, it still might be a good loan, but it is a smaller company.

是的，我們正試著這麼做。而且我們在選擇主辦行（agent）時確實更謹慎，會尋求理念一致，也可能會多看一些俱樂部型（club）交易。我覺得這很有意思，因為——我想整體而言，廣泛聯貸（broadly syndicated）的案子，確實變得越來越不吸引人。當你往更小的規模走時，因為我們現在也有一個聯貸承作/分銷團隊（syndication desk），也有人願意讓我們擔任主辦行，但這裡有個問題是：如果你遇到一家規模小到你需要持有整筆貸款的公司，而它仍然是——不論是有私募基金贊助（sponsor-backed）或家族企業等等——它仍然是一個單一企業體，會受到景氣循環、產品被淘汰、客戶集中度，以及所有這些因素的影響；它仍然可能是一筆好貸款，但它畢竟是一家較小的公司。

Whereas sometimes as you get to the club and you get to bigger, you have more resiliency because the company is bigger, but then you end up more under the control of agents or other types of wins that like sometimes the terms are a little bit looser or those bigger companies can throw their weight around a little bit more on the docks or something like that.

相較之下，有時候當你進入俱樂部型交易、規模更大時，因為公司更大，韌性也更強；但接著你往往會更受主辦行或其他類型的因素所左右——有時條款會比較寬鬆，或是那些大公司在文件條款（docs）之類的事項上能更有籌碼、施加更大的影響力。

So -- but yes, no, look, I think it's always an ongoing discussion, and we're not stopping that, but I think we're definitely looking at it and saying, okay, let's make sure that we're really thinking through which agents we want to work with.

所以——但對，是的，不，聽著，我認為這一直都是持續進行的討論，我們也不會停止，但我想我們確實正在檢視並說，好吧，讓我們確保我們真的把要與哪些代理/合作方一起合作這件事想清楚。

Andrew Liesch, StoneX.

Andrew Liesch，StoneX。

Just want to talk about the deposits that are going to come on from Capital One. I understand that the $2.3 billion from Jenius, you're going to -- you've already used some of that to pay down some of those borrowings. But you had this $3.2 billion coming on with Capital One. Is that all going to fund loan growth? I mean what's your initial thoughts on that? Do you hold that in cash for a little bit until the loan growth comes? How should we think about that new influx?

我想談談將從 Capital One 轉入的存款。我理解來自 Jenius 的 23 億美元，你們將會——你們已經用其中一部分去償還一些借款。但你們還有來自 Capital One 的 32 億美元將轉入。那筆資金會全部用來支持貸款成長嗎？我的意思是，你們對此的初步想法是什麼？你們會先把它以現金形式持有一段時間，等貸款成長跟上嗎？我們應該如何看待這波新的資金流入？

Right. Yes. I mean I think we're going to look and we're going to see -- I think in general, we'll probably look to -- look at any kind of higher cost, more sort of institutional style deposit relationships and see if we can scale those back without just on a volume basis, maybe not the relationship itself and then allow that to fill back in. So that will be one way to do that.

對。是的。我的意思是，我想我們會去看、也會去觀察——我想一般而言，我們可能會考慮——檢視任何成本較高、較偏機構型態的存款關係，看看能否在不單純以量為基礎的前提下把那些規模縮小一些；也許不是縮減關係本身，而是縮減量，然後讓其他部分再補回來。所以這會是一種做法。

But in general, I would say that, that is the right way to think about it that it will just fund loan growth and allow us to be maybe less aggressive than we would have to be in marketing expense or things like that. We'll have to look. We kind of -- whether we can -- whether that impacts some of the pricing on some of the other portfolio. But yes, that's basically it. So it would be looking first at institutional type stuff that maybe we don't feel like there's a lot of cross-sell value or things like that. And then from there, it will end up on the balance sheet and to fund loan growth.

但整體而言，我會說，這樣理解是對的：它會用來支持貸款成長，並讓我們在行銷費用或類似事項上不必像原本那樣積極。我們還得再看。我們有點——是否能——以及那是否會影響其他一些投資組合的定價。但對，基本上就是這樣。所以會先看那些機構型的東西，可能我們覺得交叉銷售價值不大或類似的。然後從那裡開始，它最終會留在資產負債表上，用來支持貸款成長。

We should have at least a quarter overhang of that --

我們至少會有一季的結轉/滯留影響--

Yes, there'll be a [hash].

是的，會有一個[hash]。

Normal run rate.

正常的運行水準。

Right. Yes, there'll be overhang for a bit. And that will push down stated NIM, but I mean, obviously won't affect NII, but --

對。是的，會有一段時間的結轉/滯留影響。那會壓低表列的 NIM（淨利差），但我的意思是，顯然不會影響 NII（淨利息收入），但是--

Kelly Motta, KBW.

Kelly Motta，KBW。

I did want to touch on -- you had some really fabulous noninterest-bearing deposit growth this quarter. And I believe in your prepared remarks, you noted that you've been really successful at cross-selling noninterest-bearing accounts to the Jenius, the accounts you brought over from Jenius. Just wondering if you could provide any color or commentary around the drivers of noninterest-bearing growth and what you saw from that channel and your expectations for the continued cross-sell of that ahead?

我確實想提一下——你們本季的無息存款成長非常亮眼。而且我記得在你們的準備講稿中，你們提到你們在把無息帳戶交叉銷售給 Jenius——也就是你們從 Jenius 帶過來的那些帳戶——方面非常成功。想請問你們能否分享一些背景或評論，談談無息存款成長的驅動因素、你們從那個通路看到的情況，以及你們對未來持續推進該交叉銷售的預期？

Right, right. Yes. No, we did have some nice cross-sell on the Jenius deposits on checking. But even given the relatively high number of those, the balances are not so crazy that they move the needle like here. The clearing sweep was around $150 million of that. This direct C&I cross-sell for lending was another $100 million. What we're calling private banking, which is essentially something along some of those things is like another $100 million and then some of the specialty and fund banking was around another $120 million or something. So it was pretty broad-based, but I think it was great, and that was really good. But yes, the cross-sell strategy, I always wanted to work more and faster, but there's a really -- we had a really good quarter there with respect to that.

對，對。是的。不，我們確實在 Jenius 存款的支票帳戶上做了一些不錯的交叉銷售。但即便那類帳戶數量相對較高，其餘額也沒有高到會像這裡一樣顯著影響整體。清算掃款（clearing sweep）大約貢獻了其中的 1.5 億美元。直接的 C&I（商業與工業）放款交叉銷售又貢獻了 1 億美元。我們所稱的私人銀行（private banking），本質上是其中一些類似的項目，大約又是 1 億美元；另外一些專業領域與基金銀行業務大約再貢獻 1.2 億美元左右。所以來源相當廣泛；我認為這很棒，表現真的很好。但對，交叉銷售策略我一直希望能做得更多、更快，不過就這方面而言，我們這一季確實做得很不錯。

Got it. That's really helpful. And it seems like with your expectation for stable margin, understanding there's some components here with potential excess liquidity with the timing of things. But it seems like you're poised for another strong double-digit growth in operating revenues in the coming year. Just wondering how we should be thinking about -- I know you've given some commentary about operating leverage and potentially your ability to slow some marketing expenses and other things as you leverage what you've done. Any updated thoughts on that would be helpful.

了解。這很有幫助。而且看起來在你們預期利差穩定的情況下——我理解這裡有一些因時點造成的潛在超額流動性因素——但看起來你們在來年有望再度實現營運收入的強勁雙位數成長。想請問我們應該如何思考——我知道你們先前談過營運槓桿，以及在運用既有成果的同時，可能有能力放慢一些行銷費用和其他支出。若有任何最新想法會很有幫助。

Yes. We're -- I've given previously that cap that said we wouldn't increase the sum of personnel expenses plus professional services greater than our increase in our revenue, essentially our noninterest income and net interest income. I'm still holding to that, including what we're doing with Arc. But look, I think that -- I think we do see a lot of benefit from AI. We also have just changes that are happening in the company that are really, really positive like the speed at which you can build software also puts pressure on the product team. So we're adding some product people and things like that.

是的。我之前給過一個上限：也就是我們不會讓人事費用加上專業服務費用的合計增幅，超過我們收入的增幅——基本上就是我們的非利息收入與淨利息收入的增幅。我仍然會遵守這個原則，包括我們在 Arc 上所做的事情。但聽著，我想——我確實看到 AI 帶來很多效益。公司內也有一些變化正在發生，真的非常正面；例如軟體開發速度的提升也會對產品團隊形成壓力。所以我們正在增加一些產品人員之類的配置。

But I feel pretty good about where it is. I think on a conservative basis, saying that we'll have a flat to improving efficiency ratio, I think, is a fair way to say it. But yes, there's -- we kind of -- we did get rid of a lot of the dead weight in the company. There's not a lot of folks that are not performing right now. And so that we're probably at a low level of underperformers even relative to our historic.

但我對目前的狀況感覺相當不錯。我認為以保守的角度來說，表示我們的效率比率將持平到改善，我覺得這樣說是合理的。但對——我們某種程度上——我們已經把公司裡很多冗員清掉了。目前表現不佳的人不多。因此，相較於我們過去的歷史水準，我們的低績效人員比例可能已經處在較低的水位。

I think we have an historically low level, but I think we're at a really historically low level now. So that means that there may be a few adds here and there. But it's -- I don't think it's going to be anything -- obviously, Derrick guided on that side with Arc, but also a lot of those folks are folks that we are kind of going to go out and hire anyway.

我認為我們一直以來低績效人員的比例就偏低，但我覺得現在是歷史上非常低的水準。這表示可能會在這裡那裡補幾個人。但——我不認為會是什麼——顯然 Derrick 在 Arc 那邊已經給過指引；而且其中很多人其實也是我們本來就打算出去招募的人。

So that may pull it a little bit forward over what it otherwise would have been. But I feel pretty good about controlling expenses. I mean there's some really big interesting things going on that really have just made a lot of what we're doing just so much more efficient. And so I feel pretty good about that. I know it's not a perfect answer, but I don't want to be overly optimistic, but I think, Derrick, do you have any color there?

所以相較於原本的情況，這可能會把一些增員時點稍微提前。但我對費用控管相當有信心。我的意思是，現在有一些非常重大且有趣的事情正在發生，確實讓我們做的很多事情效率大幅提升。所以我對此感覺很好。我知道這不是一個完美的答案，我不想過度樂觀，但我想，Derrick，你那邊有沒有什麼補充？

Yes. Not a whole lot. The -- obviously, the jump up this past year was primarily due to Verdant. So we won't expect that sort of jump up in depreciation and amortization from those operating leases that it should be -- I think Greg's comment about flat to improving efficiency ratio from where we're at is accurate. And that's excluding the $21 million -- (multiple speakers)

是的。沒有太多補充。——顯然，去年這一波的跳升主要是因為 Verdant。所以我們不預期折舊與攤銷會再出現那種幅度的跳升（來自那些營運租賃）；它應該會——我認為 Greg 關於效率比率從目前水準持平到改善的評論是正確的。而且那還不包含 2,100 萬美元——（多位講者）

Right, right. Yes, right. Onetime stuff excluded, yes.

對，對。是的，對。一次性項目排除在外，是的。

Got it. Last question for me, just because most have been asked and answered. Just quickly on the buyback. You were a bit active during the quarter when the stock was trading a bit lower. Fair to say, given your outlook for continued strong growth and potential M&A ahead that you're opportunistic. But may not be repurchasing up here? Or any kind of guidepost in terms of how you're thinking about it, whether it be the earn-back or capital would be helpful.

了解。我最後一個問題，因為大多數都已經問過也回答了。快速問一下回購。當季股價交易在較低水位時，你們有稍微積極一些。公平地說，考量你們對持續強勁成長的展望以及未來可能的併購（M&A），你們是機會主義的。但在目前這個價位可能不會回購？或者就你們的思考方式給個參考點，不論是回本（earn-back）或資本配置方面，都會有幫助。

We're always very flexible with those things. And as the prospects of the company continue to improve, our willingness to buy back stock continues to increase. And so we always look at that as a balance. So I refuse to be pinned down on any such definitive statement as you may say. But when the whims of the market blow against us, it often is a good time for us to jump in there and grab a few shares.

我們在這些事情上一直都非常有彈性。而且隨著公司前景持續改善，我們回購股票的意願也持續提高。所以我們總是把它視為一種平衡。因此我拒絕被你所說的那種明確說法給框住。但當市場的風向對我們不利時，往往就是我們進場買幾股的好時機。

Tim Coffey, Brean Capital.

Tim Coffey，Brean Capital。

How much of the buyback is remaining again? I missed that in your prepared remarks.

回購額度還剩多少來著？我在你們的事先準備講稿裡漏聽了。

A little over $100 million, yes.

略高於1億美元，是的。

Okay. So my core question to kind of start with, is there a through rate between higher rates and lower prepayments as you look at your portfolio?

好的。那我先從核心問題開始：就你們的投資組合來看，較高利率與較低提前還款之間是否存在傳導關係？

Yes. Candidly, not in the same way that you would think about in a lot of other banks, I think. And the reason why is we just have such low duration in what we're doing. So we just like on the single-family side, we have a bit of an overhang of lower rates. But frankly, since we had nothing over 5/1 ARMs, most of that stuff that's a little bit lower rate is adjusting.

是的。坦白說，我認為不像你在很多其他銀行會那樣去看。原因是我們在做的事情存續期（duration）非常短。所以就像在單戶住宅那邊，我們確實有一些較低利率的存量包袱。但坦白說，因為我們沒有任何超過5/1可調利率房貸（ARM）的產品，那些利率稍低的多數都在調整中。

And then the multifamily side, we had shortened that up so much being worried about higher rates. We're super well positioned for that. That stuff is really kind of all -- I mean, almost all at market now. There might be a few $100 million, $500 million or something here or there. So I don't -- and then the rest of it is floating.

然後在多戶住宅那邊，因為擔心利率走高，我們把存續期縮短了很多。我們在這方面的部位非常到位。那些基本上都已經——我是說，幾乎全部都已經接近市場利率水準了。可能零星還有幾億美元，比如1億、5億之類的在這裡或那裡。所以我不——然後其餘的都是浮動利率。

So -- and it's floating off short indexes. So movements in the long rate kind of -- I think the biggest impact that they have there is they -- I mean, mortgage banking has been frankly --

所以——而且是跟短端指標連動的浮動利率。因此長端利率的變動在那邊——我認為它們最大的影響是——我是說，按揭銀行業務坦白說一直--

The MSR portfolio.

MSR投資組合。

The MSR, right. MSR, a little bit of mortgage banking demand, we have to deal with like they've -- even though the jumbo book has been flat, they had a really good origination quarter. I eventually think they're going to grow again. But part of what's happening is as all of those loans that are 4.5% and 5% roll off, people are leaving and because -- and then that has precipitated that not growing as much. Eventually, that will, I think, slow down. We'll be able to grow that a bit.

MSR，對。MSR，以及一些按揭銀行業務需求，我們得面對像是——即使大額房貸（jumbo）帳簿持平，他們這季的承作量（origination）非常好。我最終認為他們會再度成長。但目前發生的一部分情況是，當所有4.5%和5%的貸款到期退出時，人們就離開了，因為——然後這也導致它沒有成長那麼多。我認為最終這會放緩。我們也就能讓那塊再成長一些。

But yes, no, I don't really see -- I understand where that dynamic would come in if we had a longer durated book. And then on the leasing side, which you do end up with a certain duration on those leases, there is no prepay ability. So it's just you're paying or -- so it is what it is. You don't get to prepay. I mean unless you want to pay.

但對，不，我不太看到——我理解如果我們有一個存續期更長的帳簿，這種動態會如何出現。另外在租賃端，你確實會在那些租約上承擔一定的存續期，但沒有提前清償的可能。所以就是你要付——就這樣，情況就是如此。你不能提前清償。我是說，除非你願意付錢。

We love when they do because it reduced the yield.

我們很喜歡他們這麼做，因為那會降低收益率。

You can pay everything if you want. But obviously, that's not that good for the client, so they really do it. But yes.

如果你想，你可以把全部都付清。但顯然那對客戶不是那麼好，所以他們其實不太會這麼做。但對。

Okay. Well, not a high-quality problem when I pay you back. Looking at noninterest income, if you strip out mortgage banking, is it a reasonable expectation to think that number increases 2% a quarter or so?

好的。嗯，當我把錢還給你，這不是什麼高品質的問題。看非利息收入，如果把按揭銀行業務剔除，你覺得合理的預期是那個數字每季增加約2%嗎？

Roughly speaking, yes, I think that's reasonable. We obviously had a high prepayment penalty fee income quarter. So that's a little bit abnormal. So if you normalize that and then jump off of that, I think that's reasonable on a quarterly basis.

大致上是的，我覺得這是合理的。我們這一季的提前清償違約金費用收入特別高。所以那有點不尋常。因此如果把它正常化，然後以此為基礎往上推，我認為以季度來看是合理的。

There are no further questions at this time. I'll pass it back to management for any closing remarks.

目前沒有進一步的問題。我把時間交回管理層做結語。

Thank you, everybody. We'll talk to you next quarter.

謝謝各位。我們下個季度再談。

This concludes today's teleconference. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.

今天的電話會議到此結束。您現在可以掛斷電話線。感謝您的參與。