Axos Financial Inc (AX) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the Axos Financial's Fourth Quarter 2023 Earnings Call. (Operator Instructions) Please note that this conference is being recorded. I will now turn the conference over to our host, Johnny Lai, Senior Vice President, Corporate Development and Investor Relations. Thank you. You may begin.

您好，歡迎參加 Axos Financial 的 2023 年第四季度收益電話會議。 （操作員說明）請注意，本次會議正在錄製中。我現在將會議交給我們的東道主、企業發展和投資者關係高級副總裁約翰尼·賴 (Johnny Lai)。謝謝。你可以開始了。

Thank you, Agon, and good afternoon, everyone, and thanks for your interest in Axos.

謝謝您，Agon，大家下午好，感謝您對 Axos 的興趣。

Joining us today for Axos Financial, Inc.'s Fourth Quarter 2023 Financial Results Conference Call are the company's President and Chief Executive Officer, Greg Garrabrants and Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer, Derrick Walsh; and Executive Vice President of Finance, Andy Micheletti.

今天參加 Axos Financial, Inc. 2023 年第四季度財務業績電話會議的有該公司總裁兼首席執行官 Greg Garrabrants 以及執行副總裁兼首席財務官 Derrick Walsh；和財務執行副總裁安迪·米凱萊蒂 (Andy Micheletti)。

Greg and Derrick will review and comment on the financial and operational results for the 3 and 12 months ended June 30, 2023, and we will be available to answer questions after the prepared remarks.

Greg 和 Derrick 將審查並評論截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的 3 個月和 12 個月的財務和運營業績，我們將在準備好的發言後回答問題。

Before I begin, I would like to remind listeners that prepared remarks made on this call may contain forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties and that management may make additional forward-linking statements in response to your questions. Please refer to the safe harbor statement found in today's earnings press release and in our investor presentation for additional detail.

在開始之前，我想提醒聽眾，本次電話會議中準備好的發言可能包含前瞻性陳述，這些陳述存在風險和不確定性，管理層可能會針對您的問題做出額外的前瞻性鏈接陳述。請參閱今天的收益新聞稿和我們的投資者演示文稿中的安全港聲明，了解更多詳細信息。

This call is being webcast, and there will be an audio replay available in the Investor Relations section of the company's website located at axosfinancial.com for 30 days. Details for this call were provided on the conference call announcement and in today's earnings press release.

本次電話會議正在進行網絡直播，公司網站 axosfinancial.com 的投資者關係部分將提供為期 30 天的音頻重播。此次電話會議的詳細信息已在電話會議公告和今天的收益新聞稿中提供。

Before handing the call over to Greg, I'd like to remind our listeners that in addition to the earnings press release and 8-K, we also issued an earnings supplement for this call. All of these documents can be found on the axosfinancial.com website.

在將電話會議交給格雷格之前，我想提醒我們的聽眾，除了收益新聞稿和 8-K 之外，我們還為本次電話會議發布了收益補充材料。所有這些文件都可以在 axosfinancial.com 網站上找到。

With that, I'd like to turn the call over to Greg.

說到這裡，我想把電話轉給格雷格。

Thank you, Johnny. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us. I'd like to welcome everyone to Axos Financial's conference call for the fourth fiscal quarter ended June 30, 2023. I thank you for your interest in Axos Financial and Axos Bank.

謝謝你，約翰尼。大家下午好，感謝您加入我們。歡迎大家參加 Axos Financial 截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的第四財季電話會議。感謝大家對 Axos Financial 和 Axos Bank 的興趣。

We delivered double-digit year-over-year growth in earnings per share, book value per share and ending loan and deposit balances. Our consistently strong results were broad-based with strong net interest margins and double-digit net interest income growth. We grew deposits approximately 23% year-over-year despite an expected normalization in cash sorting deposits from our custody business. We reported net income of $87 million and earnings per share of $1.46 for the 3 months ended June 30, 2023, representing year-over-year growth of 51% and 52%, respectively.

我們的每股收益、每股賬面價值以及期末貸款和存款餘額均實現了兩位數的同比增長。我們持續強勁的業績基礎廣泛，淨息差強勁，淨利息收入實現兩位數增長。儘管我們的託管業務現金分類存款預計將正常化，但我們的存款同比增長約 23%。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的三個月，我們的淨利潤為 8700 萬美元，每股收益為 1.46 美元，同比分別增長 51% 和 52%。

Our book value per share was $32.53 at June 30, 2023, up 18% from June 30, 2022.

截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，我們的每股賬面價值為 32.53 美元，較 2022 年 6 月 30 日增長 18%。

The highlights this quarter include the following: Net interest income increased by 2.4% linked quarter and 23.2% year-over-year to $203.8 million. We continue to generate a strong net interest income growth through a combination of loan growth and solid net interest margin. For the fiscal year ended June 30, 2023, we grew net interest income by $176 million or 29%.

本季度的亮點包括： 淨利息收入環比增長 2.4%，同比增長 23.2%，達到 2.038 億美元。通過貸款增長和穩健的淨息差的結合，我們繼續實現強勁的淨利息收入增長。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的財年，我們的淨利息收入增長了 1.76 億美元，即 29%。

Ending net loans for investment balance was $16.6 billion, up 3.9% linked quarter or 15.7% annualized. Loan growth was broad-based with growth in single-family warehouse, asset-based lending and C&I loans, partially offset by our deliberate pullback in auto and personal unsecured multifamily and leasing.

期末投資淨貸款餘額為 166 億美元，環比增長 3.9%，年化增長 15.7%。貸款增長基礎廣泛，單戶倉庫、資產貸款和工商業貸款的增長，部分被我們有意縮減的汽車和個人無擔保多戶住宅和租賃業務所抵消。

Ending deposits increased by approximately $384 million linked quarter, driven primarily by consumer deposits. Our diverse source of funds enable us to grow deposits despite industry-wide competition for consumer and commercial deposits.

季度末存款增加約 3.84 億美元，主要由消費者存款推動。儘管全行業都在爭奪消費者和商業存款，但我們多元化的資金來源使我們能夠增加存款。

Net interest margin was 4.19% for the third quarter, down 23 basis from 4.42% in the quarter ended March 31, 2023, and comparable to the 4.19% in the quarter ended June 30, 2022. The impact of excess liquidity on our net interest margin accounted for approximately 20 basis points of the sequential net interest margin decline, resulting in only a 3 basis point sequential quarterly decline not attributed to the excess liquidity. Net interest margin for the 12 months ended June 30, 2023, was 4.35%, up 22 basis points from 4.13% in fiscal year 2022.

第三季度淨息差為4.19%，較截至2023 年3 月31 日止季度的4.42% 下降23 個基點，與截至2022 年6 月30 日止季度的4.19% 相當。 流動性過剩對淨利息的影響淨息差環比下降約佔 20 個基點，導致淨息差僅環比下降 3 個基點，且並非流動性過剩所致。截至2023年6月30日的12個月淨息差為4.35%，較2022財年的4.13%上升22個基點。

Unlike most other banks, we have successfully increased our net interest margin in the past 12 months. Axos Securities comprised primarily of our custody and clearing businesses made positive contributions to our fee and net income. Broker-dealer fees increased 103% year-over-year due to higher interest rates and increased client activity. Quarterly pretax income for our securities business was $15.5 million and $59.6 million for the 3 and 12 months ended June 30, 2023.

與大多數其他銀行不同，我們在過去 12 個月內成功提高了淨息差。 Axos 證券主要由我們的託管和清算業務組成，為我們的費用和淨利潤做出了積極貢獻。由於利率上升和客戶活動增加，經紀交易商費用同比增長 103%。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的 3 個月和 12 個月，我們證券業務的季度稅前收入分別為 1,550 萬美元和 5,960 萬美元。

Our credit quality remains strong with net annualized charge-offs to average loans of only 4 basis points in the 3 and 12 months ended June 30, 2023. Of the 4 basis points of net charge-offs this quarter, 2 basis points were from auto loans that are covered by insurance policies.

我們的信貸質量依然強勁，截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的 3 個月和 12 個月內，平均貸款年化淨沖銷僅 4 個基點。本季度的 4 個基點淨沖銷中，2 個基點來自汽車保險單承保的貸款。

Double-digit growth in net interest income and positive operating leverage resulted in a 43% year-over-year growth in our pretax income and a 52% increase in our diluted earnings per share. Even if you normalize our fourth quarter 2023 tax rate to 30%, our diluted earnings per share were up 44% year-over-year. We generated a 1.73% return on assets and an 18.6% return on equity for the quarter ended June 30, 2023.

淨利息收入的兩位數增長和正運營槓桿導致我們的稅前收入同比增長 43%，稀釋每股收益增長 52%。即使將 2023 年第四季度的稅率正常化至 30%，我們的攤薄每股收益仍同比增長 44%。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的季度，我們的資產回報率為 1.73%，股本回報率為 18.6%。

Our capital levels remained strong with Tier 1 leverage ratio of 9.7% of the bank and 9% at the holding company, both well above our regulatory requirements. We repurchased approximately $17.7 million of common stock in the fourth quarter, in addition to the $31.6 million we repurchased in the third quarter to take advantage of the unwarranted decline in our share price in reaction to the turmoil in the banking industry. This brings our total shares repurchased in fiscal 2023 to $49 million at an average share price of $37.28 per share. We have approximately $104 million remaining in our share repurchase authorization at the end of fiscal year 2023.

我們的資本水平保持強勁，銀行一級槓桿率為 9.7%，控股公司一級槓桿率為 9%，均遠高於我們的監管要求。除了第三季度回購的 3160 萬美元普通股外，我們在第四季度回購了約 1770 萬美元的普通股，以利用因銀行業動盪而導致的股價無理下跌。這使得我們在 2023 財年回購的股票總額達到 4900 萬美元，平均股價為每股 37.28 美元。截至 2023 財年末，我們的股票回購授權尚剩餘約 1.04 億美元。

Our profitability, liquidity, balance sheet positioning and growth outlook all remain favorable. From a liquidity and capital perspective, we emerged from the turmoil even stronger. We increased deposits by almost $400 million this past quarter and by over $3 billion in the past 12 months, with approximately 90% of our total deposits being FDIC insured or collateralized.

我們的盈利能力、流動性、資產負債表定位和增長前景均保持良好。從流動性和資本的角度來看，我們從動盪中變得更加強大。上個季度我們的存款增加了近 4 億美元，過去 12 個月增加了超過 30 億美元，其中約 90% 的存款由 FDIC 承保或抵押。

We had $2.4 billion of cash and cash equivalents at 6/30/2023, equal to 141% of our uninsured deposits. We have no outstanding borrowing from the Fed discount window or the bank term loan funding program. We had no overnight borrowing from the Federal Home Loan Bank as of June 30, 2023, and we have $3.7 billion of undrawn capacity at the discount window and an additional $3.1 billion of immediately available undrawn capacity at the Federal Home Loan Bank at quarter end. The combined cash and undrawn liquidity available at approximately $9 billion at quarter end, equals to over 500% of our uninsured and uncollateralized deposits.

截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，我們擁有 24 億美元的現金和現金等價物，相當於我們未投保存款的 141%。我們沒有來自美聯儲貼現窗口或銀行定期貸款融資計劃的未償還借款。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，我們沒有從聯邦住房貸款銀行借入隔夜借款，貼現窗口有 37 億美元的未動用能力，季度末聯邦住房貸款銀行還有 31 億美元的立即可用未動用能力。截至季度末，可用現金和未提取流動資金合計約為 90 億美元，相當於我們無保險和無抵押存款的 500% 以上。

Unlike many other banks with a significant unrealized loss in their securities and loan portfolio, we had a de minimis $9.3 million unrealized loss on our available-for-sale securities portfolio as of the end of our fiscal year. We reduced our available-for-sale portfolio from $280 million last quarter to $232 million. The fair value of our loans held for investment was a negative $40 million at June 30, 2023, equal to only 2% of our stockholders' equity.

與許多其他在證券和貸款投資組合中存在重大未實現損失的銀行不同，截至本財年末，我們的可供出售證券投資組合的未實現損失微乎其微，為 930 萬美元。我們將可供出售的投資組合從上季度的 2.8 億美元減少到 2.32 億美元。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，我們為投資而持有的貸款的公允價值為負 4000 萬美元，僅相當於我們股東權益的 2%。

Our favorable liquidity and capital position are a result of our deliberate decisions not to extend the maturity in our securities and loan portfolios and to reposition our loan mix from hybrid SFR, single-family mortgages and multifamily mortgages to variable rates, C&I loans or interest rates when they're 0. We have always maintained a disciplined policy of pricing our loans with the appropriate rate fee structure and terms commensurate with our risk and return objectives. We also proactively established channels where we can sell or pledge our loans quickly as the contingency plan should any adverse events arise.

我們良好的流動性和資本狀況源於我們深思熟慮的決定，即不延長證券和貸款組合的期限，並將我們的貸款組合從混合SFR、單戶抵押貸款和多戶抵押貸款重新定位為可變利率、C&I 貸款或利率當它們為 0 時。我們始終堅持嚴格的政策，以適當的利率費用結構和與我們的風險和回報目標相稱的條款來定價我們的貸款。我們還主動建立了快速出售或質押貸款的渠道，作為出現任何不良事件時的應急計劃。

Shifting to interest rate risk management. We continue to generate an above-average net interest margin and grow deposits while maintaining a neutral to slightly asset-sensitive balance sheet. This quarter, our consolidated net interest margin was 4.19%, while our bank-only net interest margin was 4.2%. Excluding the full quarter impact from the excess liquidity we built at the start of the banking crisis in March, our consolidated net interest margin would have been 4.39%, above our guidance of -- range of 4.25% to 4.35%.

轉向利率風險管理。我們繼續創造高於平均水平的淨息差並增加存款，同時保持中性至輕微資產敏感的資產負債表。本季度，我們的綜合淨息差為 4.19%，而純銀行淨息差為 4.2%。排除我們在 3 月份銀行危機開始時建立的過剩流動性對整個季度的影響，我們的綜合淨息差將為 4.39%，高於我們 4.25% 至 4.35% 的指導範圍。

Our ability to maintain a net interest margin above our historic range is a function of the diverse lending and deposit franchise we have built over the past decade. We built our commercial and industrial lending verticals organically and scaled them over time. As more banks and nonbank competitors pulled out from selected asset-based commercial lending verticals, we have been able to originate high-quality loans while maintaining even better terms and pricing than we had to the bank failures. This dynamic has allowed us to offset rising deposit costs and a cyclical decline in our access advisory services deposits.

我們將淨息差維持在歷史水平之上的能力取決於我們在過去十年中建立的多元化貸款和存款業務。我們有機地構建了商業和工業貸款垂直領域，並隨著時間的推移不斷擴大規模。隨著越來越多的銀行和非銀行競爭對手退出特定的基於資產的商業貸款垂直領域，我們能夠發放高質量的貸款，同時保持比銀行倒閉時更好的條款和定價。這種動態使我們能夠抵消不斷上升的存款成本和接入諮詢服務存款的周期性下降。

At 6/30/2023, approximately 59% of our loans were floating rate, 34% were hybrid 5/1 arms and only 7% were fixed. The average duration of our commercial loan portfolio was 2 years with multifamily being the longest at an average of 2.6 years. And the vast majority of our commercial real estate lender finance loan portfolio having contractual maturities of less than 3 years, with all as floating rate other than the equipment leasing portfolio.

截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，我們約 59% 的貸款為浮動利率，34% 為混合 5/1 貸款，只有 7% 為固定利率。我們的商業貸款組合的平均期限為 2 年，其中多戶家庭貸款期限最長，平均為 2.6 年。我們絕大多數商業房地產貸款人的融資貸款組合的合同期限都在三年以下，除設備租賃組合外，全部採用浮動利率。

The average yield on our held-for-investment loans was 7.51% in the fourth quarter up 44 basis points from 7.07% in the prior quarter. New loan yields were 10.2% for auto, 8.3% for multifamily, 7.4% for jumbo, a single family, and 9.4% for C&I. While we have seen a general decline in loan demand in our single-family mortgage product, we continue to selectively take market share in our other lines of business.

第四季度投資貸款平均收益率為 7.51%，較上季度的 7.07% 上升 44 個基點。汽車新貸款收益率為 10.2%，多戶型貸款收益率為 8.3%，大型單戶型貸款收益率為 7.4%，工商業型貸款收益率為 9.4%。儘管我們的單戶抵押貸款產品的貸款需求普遍下降，但我們繼續有選擇地佔據其他業務領域的市場份額。

Ending deposit balances increased $384 million or 2.3% to $17.1 billion as of June 30, 2023. Our deposits at quarter end were comprised of the following: 36% demand deposits, 56% savings in money markets and 8% certificates of deposits.

截至2023 年6 月30 日，期末存款餘額增加了3.84 億美元，即2.3%，達到171 億美元。我們季末的存款包括：36% 的活期存款、56% 的貨幣市場儲蓄和8% 的存款證。

Our depositors remain well diversified from a business mix perspective, with consumer and small business representing 57% of total deposits. Commercial, cash, treasury management and institutional represent 21%. Commercial specialty deposits representing 6%. Axos Fiduciary Services representing 6% and Axos Securities, which includes our custody and clearing business, representing another 6%. We grew deposits this quarter despite divesting approximately $71 million of deposits related to the operating and institutional accounts for digital asset companies.

從業務組合的角度來看，我們的儲戶仍然多元化，消費者和小型企業佔存款總額的 57%。商業、現金、資金管理和機構佔 21%。商業專業存款佔6%。 Axos Fiduciary Services 佔 6%，Axos Securities（包括我們的託管和清算業務）佔另外 6%。儘管剝離了與數字資產公司運營和機構賬戶相關的約 7100 萬美元存款，但本季度我們的存款仍有所增長。

Due to recent changes in the regulatory landscape for U.S. banks and digital asset companies, we've decided to exit our small incubator deposit gathering for digital asset companies that includes exchanges, brokers and firms engage in activities related to nonfungible tokens. The granularity and diversity of our deposits, particularly consumer savings and money market accounts, provides us with flexibility to match the duration and cost of funds to the duration and cost of our adjustable and hybrid loans.

由於美國銀行和數字資產公司的監管環境最近發生變化，我們決定退出針對數字資產公司的小型孵化器存款收集，其中包括交易所、經紀商和從事非同質代幣相關活動的公司。我們存款的粒度和多樣性，特別是消費者儲蓄和貨幣市場賬戶，使我們能夠靈活地將資金期限和成本與可調整和混合貸款的期限和成本相匹配。

Ending noninterest-bearing deposits, excluding fluctuations in Axos advisory services cash were down slightly from March 31, 2023 to June 30, 2023, with the ending period balances down approximately $275 million to $2.9 billion, reflecting almost entirely the reduction in AIS cash and the exit of the digital asset deposits. Total ending deposit balances at Axos Advisory Services, including those on and off Axos' balance sheets declined by $188 million in the quarter, while noninterest-bearing essentially remained flat.

2023 年3 月31 日至2023 年6 月30 日期間，期末無息存款（不包括Axos 諮詢服務現金的波動）略有下降，期末餘額減少約2.75 億美元至29 億美元，幾乎完全反映了AIS現金的減少和數字資產存款退出。 Axos Advisory Services 的期末存款餘額（包括 Axos 資產負債表內外的存款餘額）本季度下降了 1.88 億美元，而無息存款餘額基本持平。

The pace of cash sorting in our AAS deposits have slowed significantly, declining sequentially in the last quarter. We believe that the pace of cash sorting in the advisory service business has stabilized at or near the bottom, representing approximately 4.6% of assets under custody as of June 30, 2023, compared to the historic range of 6% to 7%. In addition to our Axos Securities deposits on our balance sheet, we had approximately $660 million of deposits off balance sheet at partner banks and another $700 million of deposits held at other banks by software clients in our Zenith accounting and business management vertical.

我們的 AAS 存款現金分類速度顯著放緩，上個季度連續下降。我們認為，截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，諮詢服務業務中的現金分類速度已穩定在底部或接近底部，約佔託管資產的 4.6%，而歷史範圍為 6% 至 7%。除了資產負債表上的Axos 證券存款外，我們在合作夥伴銀行的資產負債表外還有約6.6 億美元的存款，以及Zenith 會計和業務管理垂直領域的軟件客戶在其他銀行持有的另外7 億美元的存款。

We are beginning to make progress transitioning deposits from Zenith clients to our bank. Through June 30, 2023, we have successfully transitioned deposits from a few accounting firms to Axos so far. We continue to believe that the business management market represents an attractive long-term strategic opportunity for deposits and fee income.

我們開始在將 Zenith 客戶的存款轉移到我們銀行方面取得進展。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，我們已成功將存款從幾家會計師事務所轉移到 Axos。我們仍然認為，業務管理市場對於存款和費用收入來說是一個有吸引力的長期戰略機會。

We continue to refine our marketing strategies and add new accounts across many of our deposit businesses. Our strong liquidity and capital position makes us an ideal banking choice for consumers, small businesses and commercial deposit clients. Our prospect pipeline for Axos Fiduciary Services has increased with the rise of bankruptcy filings. Additionally, we have added new team members in existing and new commercial deposit verticals. We expect those new team members to contribute more meaningfully to our deposit growth in the next 6 to 9 months.

我們繼續完善營銷策略，並在許多存款業務中增加新賬戶。我們強大的流動性和資本狀況使我們成為消費者、小型企業和商業存款客戶的理想銀行選擇。隨著破產申請的增加，我們對 Axos Fiduciary Services 的潛在客戶渠道也在增加。此外，我們還在現有和新的商業存款垂直領域增加了新的團隊成員。我們預計這些新團隊成員將在未來 6 至 9 個月內為我們的存款增長做出更有意義的貢獻。

Our low loan-to-value asset-based lending philosophy continues to serve us well from a credit perspective as witnessed in the sequential decline in our nonperforming assets to loan ratio and our low net charge-off ratio this quarter. Our single-family jumbo mortgage and multifamily term loans, which represent 25% and 13% of our total loans outstanding at the end of this year, have a weighted average loan-to-value ratio of 56% and 54%, respectively. Our single-family jumbo mortgages are concentrated along the coast in markets where new and existing housing inventories are constrained and demand generally exceeds supply.

從信貸角度來看，我們基於資產的低貸款價值比貸款理念繼續為我們提供良好服務，本季度不良資產與貸款比率的連續下降以及較低的淨沖銷率就證明了這一點。截至今年年底，我們的單戶巨額抵押貸款和多戶定期貸款分別佔未償還貸款總額的 25% 和 13%，加權平均貸款價值比分別為 56% 和 54%。我們的單戶巨額抵押貸款集中在沿海市場，這些市場的新建和現有住房庫存受到限制，且需求普遍超過供應。

The lifetime losses in our originated single-family jumbo and multifamily mortgages are 4 basis points and less than 1 basis point, respectively. Our commercial real estate specialty lending business comprised of low loan-to-value lending to nonbank lenders and well-capitalized sponsors if secured by single-family, multifamily and commercial real estate properties in attractive markets and locations. Of the $5.3 billion of commercial specialty real estate loans outstanding at June 30, 2023, multifamily was the largest segment, representing 33% of total commercial specialty real estate loans, while hotel, office and retail represents 17%, 10% and 5%, respectively.

我們發起的單戶巨型抵押貸款和多戶抵押貸款的終身損失分別為 4 個基點和不到 1 個基點。我們的商業房地產專業貸款業務包括向非銀行貸款機構和資本充足的讚助商提供低貸款價值貸款，前提是以有吸引力的市場和地點的單戶、多戶和商業房地產作為抵押。截至2023 年6 月30 日，在未償還的53 億美元商業專業房地產貸款中，多戶住宅是最大的部分，佔商業專業房地產貸款總額的33%，而酒店、辦公和零售分別佔17%、 10% 和5%。分別。

On a consolidated basis, the weighted average loan-to-value of our commercial specialty real estate portfolio is 40%. For the retail and office segment of our commercial specialty real estate book, the weighted average loan-to-value was 41% and 36%, respectively. Of the $552 million commercial real estate secured by office properties at the end of the quarter, 75% are A notes or note-on-note structures with significant subordination from funding partners and mezzanine lenders, resulting in a 36% loan-to-value ratio. The majority of our commercial real estate secured by office properties are located in metropolitan areas that have not seen a meaningful negative impact from work-from-home and other dynamics. We have no office exposure in downtown Los Angeles, San Francisco, Downtown Seattle or Austin. We have incurred no lifetime losses in our entire commercial specialty real estate loan book.

在綜合基礎上，我們的商業專業房地產投資組合的加權平均貸款價值比為 40%。對於我們的商業專業房地產賬簿中的零售和辦公部門，加權平均貸款價值比分別為 41% 和 36%。截至本季度末，在由辦公物業擔保的 5.52 億美元商業房地產中，75% 是 A 類票據或票據結構，其融資合作夥伴和夾層貸款人具有顯著的從屬地位，導致貸款價值比為 36%比率。我們大部分由辦公物業擔保的商業房地產都位於大都市地區，這些地區尚未受到在家工作和其他動態的重大負面影響。我們在洛杉磯市中心、舊金山、西雅圖市中心或奧斯汀沒有辦公室。在我們的整個商業專業房地產貸款賬簿中，我們沒有遭受任何終生損失。

Our lender finance business is comprised of lines of credit to non-bank lenders. The total lender finance loans outstanding were approximately $2.6 billion as of June 30, 2023, with real estate lender finance accounting for approximately 33% of total lender finance portfolio and non-real estate lender finance accounting for the other 67%. We have a direct and a debt fund partnership business in lender finance and the weighted average loan to value for the lender finance portfolio was 54%. The loan structure and our senior position in the payment waterfall provides us with confidence that our lender finance portfolio can withstand stresses and not result in any material loss to the bank.

我們的貸方融資業務包括向非銀行貸方提供的信貸額度。截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日，未償貸方融資總額約為 26 億美元，其中房地產貸方融資約佔貸方融資投資組合總額的 33%，非房地產貸方融資佔其餘 67%。我們在貸方融資方面擁有直接和債務基金合夥業務，貸方融資投資組合的加權平均貸款價值率為 54%。貸款結構和我們在支付瀑布中的高級地位使我們有信心，我們的貸方融資組合能夠承受壓力，不會給銀行造成任何重大損失。

Our auto lending business is comprised of direct and indirect lending to prime and super-prime lenders. Ending balances declined by $42 million linked quarter to $476 million, representing only 3% of our total loans outstanding. We continue to price according to our risk appetite with new auto loans yielding 10.2% this quarter. The average FICO score for borrowers in our auto lending business is 759 with lower FICO loans being secured by credit insurance.

我們的汽車貸款業務包括向優質和超優質貸款機構提供直接和間接貸款。期末餘額環比下降 4200 萬美元，至 4.76 億美元，僅占我們未償還貸款總額的 3%。我們繼續根據風險偏好定價，本季度新增汽車貸款收益率為 10.2%。我們的汽車貸款業務借款人的平均 FICO 分數為 759，較低的 FICO 貸款由信用保險擔保。

With an overwhelming majority of our total loans outstanding secured by some form of collateral, we believe our credit will perform better through the cycle. We continue to run an efficient company with high returns while investing in new products, technologies and businesses. The efficiency ratio for our banking business was 45.1% in the fourth quarter of 2023, an improvement from 46.7% in the corresponding period a year ago.

由於我們的未償還貸款總額中絕大多數是由某種形式的抵押品擔保的，我們相信我們的信貸在整個週期中將表現更好。我們繼續運營一家高回報、高效的公司，同時投資新產品、技術和業務。 2023年第四季度，本行銀行業務效率為45.1%，較去年同期的46.7%有所改善。

From a product perspective, we have hired a few teams to help us incubate new lending and deposit verticals. We added to our fund finance team this quarter. We ended the quarter with $74 million of capital [call] loans outstanding. Our pipeline for capital call loans continues to increase as borrowers look for reliable lenders in the marketplace. We like the credit and duration risk profile for the capital call lines, and we anticipate generating deposit relationships with those borrowers.

從產品角度來看，我們聘請了一些團隊來幫助我們孵化新的借貸和存款垂直領域。本季度我們增加了基金財務團隊。本季度結束時，我們有 7400 萬美元的未償還資本[贖回]貸款。隨著借款人在市場上尋找可靠的貸方，我們的資本催繳貸款渠道不斷增加。我們喜歡資本呼叫線的信用和久期風險狀況，並且我們預計與這些借款人建立存款關係。

From a technology perspective, we continue to invest in the next version of our consumer banking platform, what we're calling Universal Digital Bank 2.0 to add new features and functionalities and a better, more integrated user experience across all consumer lending, deposit and securities products. We envision that providing a more holistic financial services platform will lead to better user engagement cross-sell and client retention. Our white label banking for registered investment advisors and introducing broker-dealers continue to make progress with a beta launch expected in the next 6 to 9 months.

從技術角度來看，我們將繼續投資下一版本的消費者銀行平台，即我們所說的通用數字銀行2.0，以添加新的特性和功能，並在所有消費者貸款、存款和證券領域提供更好、更集成的用戶體驗產品。我們預計，提供更全面的金融服務平台將提高用戶參與度、交叉銷售和客戶保留率。我們為註冊投資顧問和介紹經紀交易商提供的白標銀行業務繼續取得進展，預計將在未來 6 至 9 個月內推出測試版。

Axos Universal Core, our proprietary securities clearing platform, is also moving forward. This is a complex multiyear development that has the potential to significantly reduce costs in our securities operations and enhance our ability to win new business. We recently added a new senior executive from Pershing to augment the clearing sales team and execution initiatives that we have at Axos Clearing.

我們專有的證券清算平台 Axos Universal Core 也在向前發展。這是一個複雜的多年發展，有可能顯著降低我們的證券運營成本並增強我們贏得新業務的能力。我們最近從 Pershing 聘請了一位新的高級管理人員，以增強 Axos Clearing 的清算銷售團隊和執行計劃。

We're excited about the long-term cost savings and expanded capabilities that Axos Universal core could provide lunch that is fully developed and implemented. Axos Clearing, which includes our corresponding clearing and registered investment advisor custody business continues to provide a positive contribution to Axos. [Fee] income from the securities business doubled year-over-year in this quarter, while pretax income increased by $16 million. The primary driver of growth in fee and pretax income from Axos Securities is higher interest rates.

我們對 Axos Universal 核心可以提供完全開發和實施的午餐所帶來的長期成本節約和擴展功能感到興奮。 Axos Clearing，包括我們相應的清算和註冊投資顧問託管業務，繼續為 Axos 做出積極貢獻。 [費用]本季度證券業務收入同比增長一倍，稅前收入增加1600萬美元。 Axos 證券費用和稅前收入增長的主要驅動力是利率上升。

Total deposits at Axos Clearing were $1.6 billion at the end of the quarter, down from $1.9 billion in the prior quarter. The decline is consistent with the client cash sorting that other competitors have experienced in response to rapid increases in the Fed funds rate. Of the $1.6 billion from Axos Clearing, approximately $1 billion was on our balance sheet and $600 million was held at partner banks.

截至本季度末，Axos Clearing 的存款總額為 16 億美元，低於上一季度的 19 億美元。這種下降與其他競爭對手為應對聯邦基金利率快速上升而經歷的客戶現金分類是一致的。在 Axos Clearing 提供的 16 億美元中，大約 10 億美元在我們的資產負債表上，6 億美元存放在合作夥伴銀行。

The pipeline for new custody clients remains healthy, comprised of 43 advisory firms with $2.1 billion of combined assets under custody. The number of size in combined assets under custody of the Axos Advisory Service pipeline all more than doubled from a year ago. Once cash balances stabilize and grow, Axos Clearing will become an even more valuable asset to our firm.

新託管客戶渠道依然健康，由 43 家諮詢公司組成，託管資產總額達 21 億美元。 Axos 諮詢服務管道託管的合併資產規模比一年前增加了一倍多。一旦現金餘額穩定並增長，Axos Clearing 將成為我們公司更有價值的資產。

Our loan pipeline remains solid with approximately $1.2 billion of consolidated loans as of July 24, 2023, consisting approximately of $50 million of single-family agency gain on sale mortgages, $345 million of jumbo single-family mortgages, $66 million of multifamily and small balanced commercial real estate term loans, $751 million of C&I and commercial specialty real estate loans and $12 million of unsecured consumer loans.

截至2023 年7 月24 日，我們的貸款渠道依然穩固，綜合貸款約為12 億美元，其中包括約5,000 萬美元的單戶代理銷售抵押貸款收益、3.45 億美元的巨型單戶抵押貸款、6,600 萬美元的多戶和小型平衡貸款商業房地產定期貸款、7.51 億美元的 C&I 和商業專業房地產貸款以及 1,200 萬美元的無擔保消費貸款。

We remain confident that we'll be able to grow loan balances by high single digits to low teens year-over-year and maintain our net interest margin in the range of 4.25% to 4.35% for the next few quarters. Our loan growth outlook is based on broad-based increases in our asset-backed lending, lender finance, commercial specialty real estate and capital call lines, partially offset by declines in multifamily, small balance commercial, auto and personal and secured loans.

我們仍然有信心，未來幾個季度我們將能夠將貸款餘額同比增長高個位數到低雙位數，並將淨息差維持在 4.25% 至 4.35% 的範圍內。我們的貸款增長前景基於資產支持貸款、貸方融資、商業專業房地產和資本調用額度的廣泛增長，但部分被多戶型、小額商業、汽車和個人及擔保貸款的下降所抵消。

Our net interest margin guidance reflects loans repricing higher, offset by rising deposit cost. It also assumes that Axos Advisory Service deposits are relatively flat for the next few quarters, plus or minus $100 million. We also expect to gradually reduce our [excess] liquidity over the next few quarters, which will reduce the 20 basis points of consolidated net interest margin drag this quarter to between only 10 to 15 basis points of net interest margin drag in this coming quarter.

我們的淨息差指導反映了貸款重新定價走高，但被不斷上升的存款成本所抵消。它還假設 Axos Advisory Service 存款在接下來的幾個季度相對持平，上下浮動 1 億美元。我們還預計在未來幾個季度逐步減少[過剩]流動性，這將使本季度綜合淨息差拖累 20 個基點減少至本季度淨息差拖累僅 10 至 15 個基點。

We believe maintaining some excess liquidity is prudent given the uncertain economic and industry environment. The combination of solid loan growth and relatively stable net interest margin gives us confidence that we will generate moderate sequential net interest income growth in the second half of calendar 2023.

我們認為，鑑於經濟和行業環境的不確定性，保持一定的過剩流動性是謹慎的做法。穩健的貸款增長和相對穩定的淨息差相結合，讓我們有信心在 2023 年下半年實現適度的淨利息收入環比增長。

I'm proud of the results we delivered over the past year during an uncertain and volatile backdrop. We overcame expected and unexpected challenges by staying focused on executing our strategic and operational initiatives. Our highly profitable and diverse enterprise with strong liquidity, capital and returns allows us to reinvest in our business while having the optionality to take advantage of market dislocations through organic and inorganic means. We will deploy our capital judiciously between internal investments, accretive acquisitions of business and talent and opportunistic share buybacks.

我對我們過去一年在不確定和動蕩的背景下取得的成果感到自豪。我們通過專注於執行我們的戰略和運營計劃，克服了預期和意外的挑戰。我們的高利潤和多元化企業具有強大的流動性、資本和回報，使我們能夠對我們的業務進行再投資，同時可以選擇通過有機和無機手段利用市場混亂。我們將在內部投資、業務和人才的增值收購以及機會性股票回購之間明智地部署我們的資本。

Now I'll turn the call over to Derrick, who will provide additional details on our financial results.

現在我將把電話轉給 Derrick，他將提供有關我們財務業績的更多詳細信息。

Thanks, Greg. To begin, I'd like to highlight that in addition to our press release, an 8-K with supplemental schedules was filed with the SEC today and is available online through EDGAR or through our website at axosfinancial.com.

謝謝，格雷格。首先，我想強調的是，除了我們的新聞稿外，今天還向 SEC 提交了帶有補充時間表的 8-K，並且可以通過 EDGAR 或通過我們的網站 axosfinancial.com 在線獲取。

I will provide some brief comments on a few topics. Please refer to our press release, our SEC filings and our website for additional details. Total noninterest expenses increased by $1.4 million or 1.3% to $112.5 million in the 3 months ended June 30, 2023, compared to the quarter ended March 31, 2020. Salaries and benefits increased by $1.5 million, primarily as a result of new team member additions that Greg alluded to earlier. Advertising and promotional expenses were down by $3.7 million or 31% from the linked quarter due to a reduction in deposit marketing expenses from elevated levels in the March quarter. We expect noninterest expenses to grow sequentially at our historical average growth rate prior to the fourth quarter of 2023.

我將就幾個主題提供一些簡短的評論。請參閱我們的新聞稿、美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 備案文件和我們的網站了解更多詳細信息。與截至2020 年3 月31 日的季度相比，截至2023 年6 月30 日的三個月中，非利息支出總額增加了140 萬美元，即1.3%，達到1.125 億美元。工資和福利增加了150 萬美元，主要是由於新團隊成員的增加格雷格之前提到過。由於存款營銷費用較上一季度的高水平有所減少，廣告和促銷費用較上一季度下降了 370 萬美元，即 31%。我們預計非利息支出將在 2023 年第四季度之前以歷史平均增長率連續增長。

Our income tax rate was 25.3% for the fourth quarter ended June 30, 2023, down from 30.4% in the third quarter of 2023 and 29.2% in the fourth quarter of 2022. Our income tax expense in the fourth quarter of 2023 included $5.2 million of primarily onetime tax credits equal to approximately $0.08 per diluted share. Going forward, we continue to expect our annual income tax rate to be between 29% and 30%.

截至2023 年6 月30 日的第四季度，我們的所得稅率為25.3%，低於2023 年第三季度的30.4% 和2022 年第四季度的29.2%。2023 年第四季度的所得稅費用包括520萬美元主要一次性稅收抵免相當於稀釋後每股約 0.08 美元。展望未來，我們繼續預計年所得稅率將在 29% 至 30% 之間。

Lastly, our return on equity was 18.6%, and our return on average assets was 1.73% for the 3 months ended June 30, 2023. For fiscal 2023, our ROE and ROAA were 17.2% and 1.64%, respectively. Tier 1 leverage capital to average assets was 8.96% at June 30, 2023, compared to 9.25% at June 30, 2022. Excluding the $1.2 billion of excess cash held at June 30, the ratio would have been 9.5%.

最後，截至 2023 年 6 月 30 日的三個月，我們的股本回報率為 18.6%，平均資產回報率為 1.73%。2023 財年，我們的 ROE 和 ROAA 分別為 17.2% 和 1.64%。截至2023 年6 月30 日，一級槓桿資本與平均資產的比率為8.96%，而2022 年6 月30 日為9.25%。如果不包括截至6 月30 日持有的12 億美元超額現金，該比率將為9.5%。

Tier 1 capital, the risk-weighted assets for Axos Bank was 11.63% at 6/30/2023, up from 11.24% in the corresponding period a year ago. We continue to hold excess capital at Axos Financial and Axos Bank even after our opportunistic share repurchases, solid loan growth and continued investments in fiscal 2023. Our strong liquidity and high returns position us well to maintain consistent, profitable growth.

截至2023年6月30日，Axos Bank的一級資本風險加權資產為11.63%，高於去年同期的11.24%。即使在我們進行機會性股票回購、穩健的貸款增長和2023 財年的持續投資之後，我們仍繼續在Axos Financial 和Axos Bank 持有過剩資本。我們強大的流動性和高回報使我們能夠保持持續的盈利增長。

With that, I'll turn the call back over to Johnny.

這樣，我會將電話轉回給約翰尼。

Thanks, Derrick. Operator, we're ready to take questions.

謝謝，德里克。接線員，我們準備好回答問題了。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from Andrew Liesch with Piper Sandler.

（操作員說明）我們的第一個問題來自 Andrew Liesch 和 Piper Sandler。

Greg, just wanted to talk about the fund finance team that you've -- members that you picked up. I guess, how -- well, what sort of growth are you expecting out of this business? I mean these are pretty safe loans. So what sort of concentration would you like it to be as far as the overall portfolio over time?

格雷格，只是想談談您所擁有的基金財務團隊——您挑選的成員。我想，您預計這項業務會實現什麼樣的增長？我的意思是這些都是非常安全的貸款。那麼隨著時間的推移，您希望整體投資組合的集中程度如何？

Yes. We put in our business plan that we would achieve $1 billion of outstandings over this fiscal year. The pipeline is very strong, obviously, because of the nature of the competition in that business, obviously, having unrelated issues. So there's a lot of opportunity in the market right now. We're getting a lot of looks. And frankly, we know a lot of the folks that are involved here because we lend to them on the asset level side, so it's a very familiar relationship. They're familiar with us. I think the difference is that, frankly, those facilities often had economics that were not favorable.

是的。我們在業務計劃中提出，本財年將實現 10 億美元的未償清償。顯然，由於該業務競爭的性質，管道非常強大，顯然存在不相關的問題。所以現在市場上有很多機會。我們受到了很多關注。坦率地說，我們認識很多參與這裡的人，因為我們在資產層面向他們提供貸款，所以這是一種非常熟悉的關係。他們對我們很熟悉。坦率地說，我認為區別在於，這些設施的經濟效益往往並不理想。

But with the exit of so many competitors in that market, it allows the economics to move to a place, the reference rate, the Fed funds rate plus the exit has allowed that business to come into a place where we believe that it's clearly a low-risk business and now the return is in a place that makes it desirable.

但隨著該市場上眾多競爭對手的退出，它使經濟轉向了一個地方，參考利率、聯邦基金利率加上退出，使該業務進入了一個我們認為明顯較低的位置。 - 風險業務，現在回報處於理想的位置。

Got it. And then just shifting gears to the margin a little bit, just with looking at asset betas as well as deposit betas, I mean how have they tracked over this tightening cycle based -- versus your initial expectations? Is the beta of 1 stronger than the other? And how do you think they're going to perform here with this latest rate hike?

知道了。然後稍微調整一下邊際，看看資產貝塔值和存款貝塔值，我的意思是，與你最初的預期相比，他們在這個緊縮週期中的表現如何？ 1 的貝塔值比另一個更強嗎？您認為他們在最近一次加息後會表現如何？

I think we're going to be essentially flattish with respect to that. So I think we've almost gone -- I mean, we really have -- we obviously have had NIM expansion in the rate cycle. So that would -- I mean, obviously not telling anything you don't know, mean that we had higher level asset betas. But I think that also is reflective of a continued shift in mix, right? And so we obviously have on the side of asset betas that are lower, obviously, the 5-1 arm, single family and then the multifamily side.

我認為我們對此基本上持平態度。所以我認為我們幾乎已經完成了——我的意思是，我們確實已經完成了——我們顯然已經在利率週期中實現了淨息差擴張。所以，我的意思是，顯然不告訴任何你不知道的事情，意味著我們有更高水平的資產貝塔值。但我認為這也反映了組合的持續轉變，對嗎？因此，我們顯然站在資產貝塔係數較低的一邊，顯然是 5-1 組、單戶家庭，然後是多戶家庭。

Now in each case, what we had done on the multifamily side is we started doing 3-1 arms several years ago. So we have a very significant portion of that portfolio repricing next year. It's about $1 billion of that that's going to reprice. And we've given data on that before. So that is a drag that will help. And then obviously, almost all the new loans, of course, and we're still growing are coming in at much higher rates, and most of them are floating as well.

現在，在每種情況下，我們在多戶家庭方面所做的都是幾年前開始做的 3-1 分支。因此，明年我們將對該投資組合的很大一部分進行重新定價。其中大約有 10 億美元將重新定價。我們之前已經提供過這方面的數據。所以這是一個有幫助的阻力。顯然，幾乎所有新貸款，當然，我們仍在增長，其利率都高得多，而且其中大部分也是浮動的。

So I mean I think we gave NIM guidance where that was. And I don't really expect that to change significantly with respect to this recent rate hike. Look, we have been adding deposit-oriented sales teams that are focused on treasury management side and cap call facilities do come with the depository relationships, and they can be more or less heavy depending on the type of fund you are dealing with, but we are actually having good success in some of the commercial deposit verticals, too.

所以我的意思是，我認為我們給了 NIM 指導。我並不認為這種情況會因最近的加息而發生重大變化。看，我們一直在增加以存款為導向的銷售團隊，他們專注於資金管理方面，而上限通知設施確實與存管關係有關，並且根據您所處理的基金類型，他們可能或多或少地繁重，但我們事實上，他們在一些商業存款垂直領域也取得了良好的成功。

So it really -- all those good things get blended together. But I think we feel pretty good about where we are. And I don't think we're expecting a lot of NIM compression. There may be a few basis points here and there, but I don't think anything particularly substantive.

所以確實如此——所有這些美好的事物都融合在一起了。但我認為我們對自己所處的位置感覺很好。我認為我們並不期望進行大量 NIM 壓縮。可能到處都有一些基點，但我不認為有什麼特別實質性的。

Got it. Those multifamily loans that repriced higher in the next year. Any credit concerns with the new rates they're going to be going to?

知道了。這些多戶家庭貸款在明年重新定價更高。他們將採用的新利率有任何信用問題嗎？

Generally, no, and we've been going through them, but 1 of our strategies was that what we did is we basically chose to do those loans at lower loan to values than average in the market. Those loans are, in that portfolio, are all personally guaranteed. So I know that the standard in the market for a lot of banks were to do those loans nonrecourse. We never did those loans nonrecourse. And so -- and then what we also did is we often were involved in where there is substantial property improvements in those. So what we were trying to do is find loans that after the improvements happened, and the low LTVs that we had that we would still have double-digit debt yields.

一般來說，不會，我們一直在研究這些問題，但我們的策略之一是，我們基本上選擇以低於市場平均水平的貸款價值發放這些貸款。在該投資組合中，這些貸款均由個人擔保。所以我知道許多銀行的市場標準是提供無追索權的貸款。我們從未做過那些無追索權貸款。因此，我們還經常參與那些有重大財產改善的活動。因此，我們試圖做的是找到在改善發生後的貸款，以及我們擁有的低貸款價值比，我們仍將擁有兩位數的債務收益率。

So look, it's possible that some folks have cash flow constraints in other parts of their portfolio. We feel pretty good about that. It doesn't mean they'll be 0. But obviously, our notes are very salable and there's a very active market for folks that want multifamily properties that are fixed up and are at 50% of prior value. So I don't -- I expect that if there's constraints, people will sell that.

所以看，有些人的投資組合的其他部分可能存在現金流限制。我們對此感覺很好。這並不意味著它們將是 0。但顯然，我們的票據非常暢銷，對於那些想要已修復且價格為先前價值 50% 的多戶型房產的人們來說，這是一個非常活躍的市場。所以我不——我預計如果有限制，人們會賣掉它。

And the other thing we're doing is we're offering swaps to folks, too. So we're going and proactively saying to borrowers, the long part of the curve is significantly lower. We have an active and, I think, reasonably sophisticated swap capability. So if a borrower wants to actually save money, to have to lock themselves into a lower but longer rate, but that often can make a difference and help with cash flow as well.

我們正在做的另一件事是我們也向人們提供交換。因此，我們將主動向借款人表示，曲線的長部分明顯較低。我們擁有活躍的、我認為相當複雜的交換能力。因此，如果借款人想要真正省錢，就必須將自己鎖定在較低但較長的利率，但這通常會產生影響並有助於現金流。

So we're looking at that. And we feel pretty good about where we are just based on the nature of how we structure those deals. We really did not stay in the -- that -- high 3s, low 4%, 70% LTV, 5-1 arm space. We shortened everything up. We lowered the LTVs. We always had personal recourse. So I think all those things should make it hold up better than average.

所以我們正在研究這個。根據我們構建這些交易的性質，我們對自己所處的位置感到非常滿意。我們確實沒有停留在——那個——高三分、低4%、70% LTV、5-1 手臂空間。我們縮短了一切。我們降低了生命週期價值。我們總是有個人追索權。所以我認為所有這些因素應該讓它比平均水平更好。

Your next question comes from Gary Tenner with D.A. Davidson.

您的下一個問題來自 D.A. 的加里·坦納 (Gary Tenner)。戴維森。

A couple of questions. I missed your comments in terms of the Zenith business management product. Could you say how much you've successfully brought over to date in that product? And in the past, have you -- as you've talked about it, have you talked about any deposit amounts that are currently kind of linked to that product?

有幾個問題。我錯過了您對 Zenith 業務管理產品的評論。您能透露一下您迄今為止在該產品中成功帶來了多少成果嗎？在過去，正如您所談論的那樣，您是否談論過目前與該產品相關的任何存款金額？

Yes, there's about $700 million that are just simply accounts that are noninterest-bearing accounts at other institutions that flow through the software. And so the software is really that account -- those accounts are really just sort of, I'll be calling them dummy accounts, maybe that's not the right word, but they're just sort of completely and only accessible to the software, and it has happened to be at other institutions. We bought that software. We probably got $30 million, $40 million of that now. But they -- but we also have gotten some pretty big commitments from us, the firms -- some of the firms to move. The issue is the timing of the moves are -- they're just -- they're slow.

是的，大約有 7 億美元只是通過該軟件流轉的其他機構的無息賬戶。所以軟件實際上就是那個帳戶 - 這些帳戶實際上只是某種，我將稱它們為虛擬帳戶，也許這不是正確的詞，但它們只是完全且只能由軟件訪問，並且碰巧在其他機構也有過這種情況。我們買了那個軟件。我們現在可能拿到了 3000 萬美元、4000 萬美元。但他們——但我們也從我們公司——一些公司那裡得到了一些相當大的承諾，要搬遷。問題是這些舉措的時機——它們只是——它們很慢。

The software, we got it for, I think, a good price. We're spending time kind of putting it up. And -- but I think it's an interesting market opportunity and then we've got to move the clients and those -- and the sub accounts in those that are at those other institutions are extensive. So any 1 client might have hundreds of accounts. So just the process of moving all of it is pretty extensive, but we're hoping to accelerate it this year.

我認為，我們以一個不錯的價格購買了該軟件。我們正在花時間把它放出來。但我認為這是一個有趣的市場機會，然後我們必須轉移客戶和其他機構的子賬戶。因此，任何 1 個客戶都可能擁有數百個帳戶。因此，僅移動所有內容的過程就相當廣泛，但我們希望今年能夠加快速度。

And -- and we think over time, the product is a pretty neat product, maybe even offer to some of the registered investment advisors who might want to take some of the administrative functionality for some of their high-net-worth clients and they'll have a software to do it that's helpful and effective.

而且 - 我們認為隨著時間的推移，該產品是一個非常簡潔的產品，甚至可能提供給一些註冊投資顧問，他們可能希望為一些高淨值客戶提供一些管理功能，而他們'將有一個有用且有效的軟件來完成此任務。

And then in terms of kind of balance sheet management, you talked about reducing excess liquidity a bit over the next few quarters and you gave kind of an outlook for low double-digit loan growth for the full year. So I guess 2 questions to that. One is in terms of reducing liquidity, are you thinking of -- is there going to be kind of a throttling back of deposit generation or other use of some of that cash because you don't have any -- that really to pay down?

然後，在資產負債表管理方面，您談到了在未來幾個季度稍微減少過剩流動性，並對全年低兩位數貸款增長做出了展望。所以我想有兩個問題。一是在減少流動性方面，您是否考慮過——是否會限制存款的產生或部分現金的其他使用，因為您沒有任何——真正需要償還的資金？

Yes, I don't think that the -- we just -- we've run it at a very significant excess liquidity. We're not talking about any significant scaling back, maybe a couple of hundred million, but we'll still be well above where we were prior to the recent events of banks.

是的，我不認為——我們只是——我們是在流動性非常過剩的情況下運行的。我們並不是在談論任何大幅縮減，也許是幾億，但我們仍將遠遠高於最近銀行事件之前的水平。

Okay. Got it. And then the funds finance business, thinking about $1 billion of outstandings over fiscal '24. Is that a meaningful contributor this calendar year to the outlook?

好的。知道了。然後是基金金融業務，考慮在 24 財年有 10 億美元的未償債務。這對今年的前景有有意義的貢獻嗎？

Yes, we think it will be -- obviously, it's hard to judge this exactly, but we forecast, there could be several hundred million dollars of closings and fundings this current quarter in that business where we're in the documentation phase for hundreds of millions of dollars of that business now. And so the timing of that is -- those are fairly complex deals to paper, but it's also a very well-defined set of documentation and whatnot.

是的，我們認為這將是 - 顯然，很難準確判斷這一點，但我們預測，本季度該業務可能會有數億美元的關閉和融資，我們正處於數百個項目的文檔階段現在該業務價值數百萬美元。因此，時機是——這些交易在紙面上是相當複雜的，但它也是一組定義非常明確的文檔等等。

So I'm pretty sure they will close this quarter. They won't be -- they won't contribute much from an average income, but they will be, I think, on the books by quarter end.

所以我很確定他們會在本季度關閉。他們不會——他們不會從平均收入中貢獻太多，但我認為，到季度末他們就會記入賬簿。

Great. If I could ask 1 last question. Axos is obviously, over the last several years, felt a lot of resources into kind of building its own core and the universe of the digital bank. Strategically longer-term with all the talk about AI, can you talk about any kind of the applications within the banking industry? And anything you've thought of even though it may be way out there down the road in terms of how it could be applied in your company?

偉大的。如果我能問最後一個問題。顯然，在過去幾年中，Axos 投入了大量資源來構建自己的核心和數字銀行領域。從戰略上來看，關於人工智能的所有討論，您能談談銀行業內的任何類型的應用程序嗎？您曾經想到過什麼，即使它在如何應用到您的公司方面可能還很遙遠？

Sure, sure. The way I talk about AI with respect to how we think about it at the company is the first component of any AI-oriented process is the digitization of the process. So everything has to be digitized from a data perspective, and it has to be stored in a way that's accessible. And then the next component usually is to create rules-based engines that are associated with that. And essentially, those are much more the traditional series of [if-then] statements, right?

一定一定。我談論人工智能的方式是我們在公司如何看待它，這是任何面向人工智能的流程的第一個組成部分，那就是流程的數字化。因此，從數據的角度來看，一切都必須數字化，並且必須以可訪問的方式存儲。然後下一個組件通常是創建與之相關的基於規則的引擎。從本質上講，這些更像是傳統的一系列 [if-then] 語句，對吧？

So take a simple process of depositing a check and holding the check, a rules-based engine will say, well, this client has been here for a period of time. Their behavioral scoring is at this level. They have a very high balance. They have a securities account. They can clear a check without it being held up to a certain amount. Then what you do is you take the AI or machine learning model and you run that model in parallel to the rules-based engine. And the rules-based engine is being updated and modified by risk analysts and they're predicting -- trying to predict what that is.

因此，採取一個簡單的存入支票並持有支票的過程，基於規則的引擎會說，好吧，這個客戶已經在這裡有一段時間了。他們的行為評分處於這個水平。他們有非常高的平衡性。他們有一個證券賬戶。他們可以清算支票，而無需將其保留到一定金額。然後你要做的就是採用人工智能或機器學習模型，並與基於規則的引擎並行運行該模型。風險分析師正在更新和修改基於規則的引擎，他們正在預測——試圖預測那是什麼。

Once the machine learning AI model starts to get better, then there's a question whether you run both or you turn 1 off. And so that's 1 way of looking at these decisions, which tend to be these heavy data-oriented decisions from a risk modeling perspective. And so that really much more applies to homogenous type of oriented decisions, right, where there's a set of transactions. I mean transaction approval is another example, right? Rules-based engines are replaced by artificial intelligence that has a much more unstructured data set and allows you to do that.

一旦機器學習人工智能模型開始變得更好，那麼就會出現一個問題，是同時運行這兩個模型還是關閉其中一個模型。這是看待這些決策的一種方式，從風險建模的角度來看，這些決策往往是大量面向數據的決策。因此，這實際上更適用於同質類型的導向決策，對，有一組交易。我的意思是交易批准是另一個例子，對吧？基於規則的引擎被人工智能所取代，人工智能擁有更多的非結構化數據集，並允許您做到這一點。

There's obviously the ability to utilize certain of these products to create the frameworks for certain kinds of reports and things like that internally. I view those as much of a danger as a help because, frankly, I've had a few discussions with everyone about how there's information security concern with certain elements of those softwares if you don't -- if you use them improperly. And then also they often are just simply aggregated information, so they have to be really checked that way.

顯然有能力利用其中某些產品為某些類型的報告和類似的內部內容創建框架。我認為這些既是一種危險，也是一種幫助，因為坦率地說，我已經與每個人進行了一些討論，討論如果你不這樣做——如果你使用不當，這些軟件的某些元素會帶來信息安全問題。而且它們通常只是簡單的聚合信息，因此必須以這種方式進行真正的檢查。

And then obviously, over time, marketing analytics can also be impacted by those sort of tools. So anything that really has an analytics capability could be utilized to look at that. I will say that I don't expect over the next couple of years to have some amazing cost savings associated with that. But I do think that the nature of how we think about preparing for all of these elements, which is digitization of all activity and then rules-based engines that apply there then allow the AI decision-making to come in behind that.

顯然，隨著時間的推移，營銷分析也會受到這些工具的影響。因此，任何真正具有分析能力的東西都可以用來觀察這一點。我想說的是，我預計在未來幾年內不會出現與此相關的驚人成本節省。但我確實認為，我們考慮如何為所有這些要素做好準備的本質是所有活動的數字化，然後應用在那裡的基於規則的引擎，然後讓人工智能決策介入其中。

Our next question comes from David Feaster with Raymond James.

我們的下一個問題來自大衛·費斯特和雷蒙德·詹姆斯。

Maybe just looking at -- it's great to see the increase in originations. Appreciate your commentary on the growth outlook. If I was kind of hearing you correctly, I'm kind of just curious on what you're seeing on the demand front. It almost sounds like some of this growth is maybe competitors pulling back as they have liquidity issues versus a real increase in demand. I'm just curious, how are you seeing it from your perspective? And then maybe within CRESL, just are there any specific asset classes or regions that you're seeing notable strength?

也許只是看看——很高興看到起源的增加。感謝您對增長前景的評論。如果我沒聽錯的話，我只是對你在需求方面看到的情況感到好奇。聽起來，這種增長的一部分可能是競爭對手的撤退，因為他們面臨流動性問題，而不是實際需求的增長。我只是好奇，從你的角度來看，你是如何看待這件事的？然後也許在 CRESL 內，您是否看到任何特定的資產類別或區域具有顯著的優勢？

So the first question, I would say, is absolutely yes. We are seeing very much that way where borrowers had term sheets at institutions that are subject to liquidity issues or things like that, that are saying, we're basically shrinking. And so that's absolutely happening. And so I would say that the benefits we have. And I mean, obviously, we're relatively small and the fact where we're growing. But our competitors in certain areas like lender finance, for example, we're PacWest in Western Alliance, right?

所以我想說，第一個問題是絕對肯定的。我們看到很多這樣的情況，借款人在受到流動性問題或類似問題影響的機構中擁有條款清單，也就是說，我們基本上正在萎縮。所以這絕對會發生。所以我想說的是我們擁有的好處。我的意思是，很明顯，我們規模相對較小，而且我們正在成長。但我們在某些領域的競爭對手，例如貸款人金融，例如，我們是西方聯盟中的 PacWest，對吧？

So those -- that type of competitive dynamic is obviously beneficial to us. PacWest sold that book. That was their best book. And those clients are all now -- those are clients that we all competed for and they're all now at a private debt fund, right, including -- so private debt funds that have businesses are now at other -- being lent to by other private debt funds who are their competitors, right, who bought loans at a discount and probably don't even intend to renew them, right?

因此，這種競爭動態顯然對我們有利。 PacWest 賣掉了那本書。那是他們最好的書。這些客戶現在都是——那些是我們都競爭的客戶，他們現在都在私人債務基金中，對吧，包括——所以擁有業務的私人債務基金現在在其他地方——被借給其他私人債務基金是他們的競爭對手，對吧，他們以折扣價購買貸款，甚至可能不打算續簽，對吧？

So there's that sort of dynamic that's going on at that smaller segment level. I would say on the commercial specialty real estate side that multifamily is still going very strong, but just the competitors that are out there are just fewer, right? So the ability to just be able to take and basically get better terms is really there. And we were doing a deal, it was like a 40% loan-to-cost deal in a great area. And we're looking at it, and I just went back and just said, you know what, we're just going to get -- we normally wouldn't -- we'd be at that 40% loan to cost. There was a potential for recourse from a party that normally wouldn't get it. And we -- normally, if you ask for that, you would have been out-competing many other banks. We asked for it and they came back and after a little (inaudible) gave it to us.

因此，在較小的細分市場層面上正在發生這種動態。我想說，在商業專業房地產方面，多戶型住宅仍然非常強勁，但市場上的競爭對手只是更少，對嗎？因此，確實有能力接受並基本上獲得更好的條件。我們正在做一筆交易，就像在一個很大的地區進行 40% 的貸款成本交易。我們正在研究它，我只是回去說，你知道嗎，我們通常不會得到 40% 的貸款成本。通常情況下無法獲得援助的一方有可能獲得追索權。通常情況下，如果你要求這樣做，你就會在競爭中勝過許多其他銀行。我們要了它，他們回來了，過了一會兒（聽不清）就把它給了我們。

So even though we were just able to secure that above and beyond, I thought the 40% loan-to-cost was good. But I wanted to make sure in case there was some liquidity issues that we had this extra guarantee and we're able to get it. So that's sort of happening all the time. And so it's actually, I think, a really -- this is always the case, right, when nobody -- when people can't lend, it's always a good time to be a lender. And I think it's actually a really good time to be a lender right now. Now you obviously have to be careful because we're embedding in our assumptions that there's going to have to be a significant reequitization of most all commercial real estate. And so that's just something that you've got to take into consideration as you're looking at these things.

因此，儘管我們僅僅能夠實現這一目標，但我認為 40% 的貸款成本比還是不錯的。但我想確保萬一出現一些流動性問題，我們有這個額外的保證，並且我們能夠得到它。所以這種情況一直在發生。所以，我認為，實際上，情況總是如此，對吧，當沒有人——當人們無法放貸時，總是成為貸款人的好時機。我認為現在實際上是成為貸款人的好時機。現在，你顯然必須小心，因為我們的假設是，大多數商業房地產都必須進行大規模的重新證券化。所以這就是你在考慮這些事情時必須考慮的事情。

Okay. That's helpful. And then maybe just kind of looking at your deposit breakdown by lines of business. It looks like we saw a pretty decent decline in the commercial treasury management. I'm just curious, what are you seeing there and some of the underlying dynamics behind that? And would you expect -- I mean, has that stabilized here thus far in the quarter? And just curious what you're seeing there.

好的。這很有幫助。然後也許只是按業務範圍查看您的存款細分。看起來我們看到商業資金管理出現了相當大的下降。我只是很好奇，你在那裡看到了什麼以及背後的一些潛在動力？你會期望——我的意思是，本季度到目前為止，這種情況是否已經穩定下來？只是好奇你在那裡看到了什麼。

Yes, it has. I mean we did -- if you look the AAS deposits, we put a slide in the supplemental with respect to that. And then we did -- we had an incubator effort around the digital asset side. And we decided just not to pursue that. So there were -- there was deposits that left there for that quarter. And then there is also -- there's also -- I think actually, if you look at it, the rates actually have been actually stable to going down in that commercial deposit side. So to the extent that there were folks that got too aggressive with their rate request, we've been allowing them to exit.

是的，確實如此。我的意思是我們做到了——如果你看看 AAS 存款，我們在補充材料中放了一張與此相關的幻燈片。然後我們就這麼做了——我們圍繞數字資產方面進行了孵化器工作。我們決定不再追求這個目標。所以那個季度有一些存款。然後還有——還有——我認為實際上，如果你看一下，商業存款方面的利率實際上一直穩定下降。因此，如果有人對利率要求過於激進，我們就允許他們退出。

So we actually have been growing and improving the quality of that base, but we also -- that sometimes is a rate volume trade-off. So we feel pretty good about the ability to continue to grow those deposits. Some of these things are idiosyncratic. We had a big bankruptcy case that sat with us for years pay off. That was a $100-ish million swing. So it's nothing systemic. And we're actually having really good traction on our -- on the commercial deposit side in HOA and a variety of other verticals.

因此，我們實際上一直在發展和提高該基礎的質量，但我們有時也需要進行價格量的權衡。因此，我們對繼續增加這些存款的能力感到非常滿意。其中一些事情是特殊的。我們有一個大的破產案，多年來一直困擾著我們。那是一億美元左右的波動。所以這不是什麼系統性的東西。實際上，我們在 HOA 和各種其他垂直領域的商業存款方面擁有非常好的吸引力。

Okay. That's great. And then last quarter, we had talked about some potential opportunities coming out of the March failures. I know you've done some hiring. I'm just curious, is there still anything that you're considered or is that kind of shelved for now? And just -- are there any types of portfolio acquisitions or even beyond the bank failures that you're considering is maybe a way to accelerate expansion or segment build-out?

好的。那太棒了。上個季度，我們討論了三月份的失敗帶來的一些潛在機會。我知道你已經招聘了一些人。我只是好奇，還有什麼事情是你還在考慮的或者是暫時擱置的嗎？只是——除了您考慮的銀行倒閉之外，是否有任何類型的投資組合收購可能是加速擴張或細分市場建設的一種方式？

We're still interviewing lots of folks in different segments that we like. We hired some folks in the fund finance side. We hired some folks in the premium finance side. We like those segments. We think those are very safe and good segments from a -- just from a risk perspective. The -- we are building our -- are slowly building our offering around what our private wealth side would look like. And I think we've spent a lot of time around looking at some of the First Republic models and things like that. And we're working through the question of how successful can those models be if they're not giving away mortgages.

我們仍在採訪許多我們喜歡的不同領域的人。我們聘請了一些基金財務方面的人員。我們聘請了一些高級金融方面的人員。我們喜歡這些片段。我們認為，僅從風險角度來看，這些都是非常安全和良好的細分市場。我們正在圍繞我們的私人財富方面慢慢構建我們的產品。我認為我們花了很多時間研究一些第一共和國模型和類似的東西。我們正在解決這樣的問題：如果這些模式不放棄抵押貸款，它們能取得多大成功。

And I think that's a very interesting question. So there's been some -- we've been -- frankly, we've been close to some teams where we thought we had a shot at bringing them on and then there's been some very aggressive competitive guarantees that have come into the market that we think were overly aggressive. Sort of things like 2-year earnings guarantees, on prior earnings in a model that we feel like is broken, like the model of -- will give you a 2.5% mortgage and you put a 30-year deposits with us, right?

我認為這是一個非常有趣的問題。因此，坦率地說，我們一直與一些團隊關係密切，我們認為我們有機會吸引他們，然後市場上出現了一些非常積極的競爭保證，我們認為我們過於激進。諸如2 年收入保證之類的東西，我們認為之前的收入模型已經被打破了，就像這樣的模型——會給你2.5% 的抵押貸款，然後你向我們存入30 年期存款，對嗎？

So if you guarantee 2 years of earnings to folks, who have that model, I think you're going to be sorry. So we're taking a more measured approach. And a lot of the clients, particularly on the lending side and on the deposit side, are gradually coming to our existing team. But we are increasing the team both on the deposit and lending side. And we're going to continue to do that.

因此，如果你向採用這種模式的人保證兩年的收入，我想你會後悔的。因此，我們正在採取更加謹慎的方法。很多客戶，特別是貸款方和存款方的客戶，正在逐漸加入我們現有的團隊。但我們正在增加存款和貸款方面的團隊。我們將繼續這樣做。

I think frankly, the opportunity is not over because what everybody is doing now, right, is -- I mean, I think what we've always offered people is the ability to have a very entrepreneurial institution with great technology that can quickly attend to unique client problems and basically work with clients and be very proactive that way. And a lot of the institutions that had failed frankly, had components of that, and they failed for reasons completely unrelated to those components.

坦率地說，我認為機會還沒有結束，因為每個人現在正在做的事情，對吧，是——我的意思是，我認為我們一直為人們提供的是擁有一個非常具有創業精神的機構的能力，該機構擁有出色的技術，可以快速參與獨特的客戶問題，基本上與客戶合作，並以這種方式非常積極主動。許多坦率地失敗的機構都有這樣的成分，但它們失敗的原因與這些成分完全無關。

So those clients -- those people are now in places where I talk to a lot of them, and they're very unhappy where they are, but they've been giving guarantees. And so some of the discussions are, hey, look, I'm going to stick this out because I'm getting paid a lot do nothing right now. But -- no, seriously, but -- they are laughing at me in here, but that's a discussion. But when I don't get paid to do nothing anymore then I want to talk that to you.

所以那些客戶——那些人現在在我和他們很多人交談過的地方，他們對自己所在的地方非常不滿意，但他們一直在提供保證。所以一些討論是，嘿，聽著，我要堅持下去，因為我現在什麼都不做，拿了很多錢。但是——不，說真的，但是——他們在這裡嘲笑我，但這是一個討論。但當我不再做任何事情而得不到報酬時，我想和你談談。

So I think there's going to be a continued movement, but we're not going to be coming out, I don't think and saying we hired 100 people or something like that. I think we're going to be hiring 3s and 5s and 10s, maybe 10s and moving along to do that. I mean, frankly, we really don't want to grow. I mean we're growing assets at a level that we think is prudent given the size of -- the diversity of what we're doing. So if you actually look at each individual line of business, it's not growing that much in the quarter, even the year.

所以我認為將會有一個持續的運動，但我們不會出來，我不認為並說我們僱傭了 100 人或類似的東西。我認為我們將僱用 3 人、5 人、10 人，也許是 10 人，並繼續這樣做。坦白說，我的意思是，我們真的不想增長。我的意思是，考慮到我們正在做的事情的規模和多樣性，我們正在以我們認為謹慎的水平增加資產。因此，如果您實際查看每個單獨的業務線，就會發現它在本季度甚至全年的增長幅度都沒有那麼大。

We have a bunch of new stuff we're doing. And we have a lot of new deposit folks coming on board, too, who are making an impact. So we'll be doing more, I think, more aggressive hiring than we normally would, but not the type of hiring that you've seen from some other institutions.

我們正在做很多新的事情。我們也有很多新的存款人加入，他們正在產生影響。因此，我認為，我們將比平時進行更多、更積極的招聘，但不會像其他一些機構那樣進行招聘。

Our next question comes from Michael Perito with KBW.

我們的下一個問題來自 KBW 的 Michael Perito。

Can you guys hear me okay?

你們能聽到我說話嗎？

Yes.

是的。

Sorry about that. I don't want to take it too far here. I mean you guys answered a lot of my questions already. Maybe just 2 quick ones. Greg, just on the digital asset group, just to make sure I heard you correctly. Did you say that you have exited that business or exiting that business?

對於那個很抱歉。我不想在這裡說得太遠。我的意思是你們已經回答了我的很多問題。也許只有 2 個快速的。格雷格（Greg），只是在數字資產組，只是為了確保我沒有聽錯。你是說你已經退出那項業務還是退出那項業務？

Yes. We basically -- we started a little incubator that was looking at a few clients, and we have done some software-related work to it. And we brought a few clients onboard. But we've collectively just decided that it's -- until there's better regulatory framework around it, we're not going to really pursue it further. And so we thought of exiting the few clients that we had there. And so there's a little bit -- those were all noninterest-bearing. They weren't particularly substantial, but we really didn't plan to lever those deposits anyway given their volatility.

是的。基本上，我們啟動了一個小型孵化器，正在尋找一些客戶，並且我們已經對其做了一些與軟件相關的工作。我們還帶來了一些客戶。但我們集體決定，除非有更好的監管框架，否則我們不會真正進一步追求它。因此我們考慮退出那裡的少數客戶。所以有一點——這些都是無息的。它們並不是特別大，但考慮到它們的波動性，我們確實不打算利用這些存款。

And I just think it's just with everything going on with how the SEC is looking at these things and stuff, the exchanges and everything, is just -- we really need to just get -- we need to get better clarity around what the future is going to look like there from a regulatory perspective. And then maybe we'll [relook] at it, but I don't know.

我只是認為，美國證券交易委員會如何看待這些事情、交易所和所有事情，就是——我們真的需要——我們需要更清楚地了解未來是什麼從監管的角度來看，情況會是這樣。然後也許我們會[重新審視]它，但我不知道。

That makes sense. Yes. No, that makes sense. And that includes like operating accounts too for digital asset companies or is that just...

這就說得通了。是的。不，這是有道理的。這也包括數字資產公司的類似運營賬戶，或者只是……

It includes operating accounts, digital assets included all of it basically.

包括運營賬戶、數字資產基本上都包含了。

Perfect. And then secondly, just a really simple question. Yes, I appreciate the kind of the micro guide provided. If I look at where your consensus expectations were for fiscal '24, I think coming into the quarter, it was like $5.18. Obviously, you guys earned more than that this year. I mean environment aside, is your expectation to grow EPS in fiscal '24 year-on-year at this time, even -- I mean I'm guessing the answer is yes, but I should love to hear?

完美的。其次，這只是一個非常簡單的問題。是的，我很欣賞所提供的微型指南。如果我看看你們對 24 財年的一致預期，我認為進入本季度，大約是 5.18 美元。顯然，你們今年賺的比這個多。我的意思是，拋開環境不談，您是否期望在 24 財年實現每股收益同比增長，甚至——我的意思是，我猜答案是肯定的，但我很想听聽？

No, it's a good question. I mean, I know given how, frankly, that might -- that would normally be an easy answer, but I think maybe a lot of banks don't give that answer. Yes, I certainly intend to. Obviously, you can't make promises with respect to those (inaudible) because there's a lot to work out. But I do expect that to be the case. I think the environment is very, very good for us right now. And I think that we are positioned with probably some of the best relationship with nonbank lenders, who are interested in continuing to work with us. They are becoming more and more relevant in the market. They're taking share. We're a part of that. We are getting great people who otherwise were embedded in organizations that they wouldn't have left. And we're having really good momentum on the deposit side.

不，這是一個好問題。我的意思是，坦率地說，我知道這通常是一個簡單的答案，但我認為也許很多銀行都沒有給出這個答案。是的，我當然打算這麼做。顯然，你不能對這些（聽不清）做出承諾，因為還有很多事情需要解決。但我確實希望情況如此。我覺得現在的環境對我們來說非常非常好。我認為我們可能與非銀行貸款機構保持著最好的關係，他們有興趣繼續與我們合作。它們在市場上變得越來越重要。他們正在分享。我們是其中的一部分。我們正在招募優秀的人才，否則他們就不會離開組織。我們在存款方面的勢頭非常好。

We've done a lot on the tech side. And I think that we can do that. This quarter was obviously, the tax rate, you guys have to pay attention to that, because that tax rate is going to go up next quarter. So I would say that, frankly, the next quarters, you're going to have to be careful with forecasting. But I think we've said we think we can grow net interest income moderately throughout the year. And yes, so I think that, that certainly is an expectation. And then if we get rid of the drag, if we get rid of the drag of some of those hybrid loans repricing, then I think we're going to be in really good shape because that is the only thing that would prevent us from really taking -- getting the full advantage of the asset growth that we think we're going to have.

我們在技術方面做了很多工作。我認為我們可以做到這一點。這個季度顯然是稅率，你們必須注意這一點，因為下個季度稅率將會上升。所以我想說，坦率地說，接下來的幾個季度，你必須謹慎預測。但我認為我們已經說過，我們認為全年淨利息收入可以適度增長。是的，所以我認為，這當然是一種期望。然後，如果我們擺脫了這種拖累，如果我們擺脫了一些混合貸款重新定價的拖累，那麼我認為我們將處於非常好的狀態，因為這是唯一會阻止我們真正做到這一點的事情。充分利用我們認為將會實現的資產增長。

Great. And then maybe just 1 last one, just on liquidity, just a follow-up on an earlier question. Yes, I mean I dare to say that great clarity maybe is a little bit better than it was a year ago, right? But I mean, I think we could probably all agree that we're probably closer to the top of this cycle than the bottom. And at some point, do you guys -- you talked about your mix of loans and how it geared towards hybrid and variable. Obviously, you guys carry a lot of cash, and the bond book is fairly small. This has served you incredibly well over the last 18 months. But does it get to a point where you maybe look to shift the duration a little bit, I mean, nothing major, but is that something a conversation you guys have given where we are in the cycle or no?

偉大的。然後也許只是最後一個，只是關於流動性，只是之前問題的後續。是的，我的意思是我敢說清晰度可能比一年前好一點，對吧？但我的意思是，我想我們可能都同意，我們可能更接近這個週期的頂部而不是底部。在某些時候，你們談論過你們的貸款組合以及它如何適應混合和可變貸款。顯然，你們攜帶了大量現金，而債券賬簿相當小。在過去 18 個月裡，這對您的幫助非常大。但它是否已經到了你可能希望稍微改變持續時間的地步，我的意思是，沒什麼大不了的，但這是否是你們在我們所處的周期中進行的對話？

I would say that what our approach would be more to have floors on variable rate loans. And then you might say, well, those loans will pay off if rates go below those floors. And I think then that's a very defined problem that we can deal with. We have good origination capabilities and obviously, the ability to negotiate floors. So I think that's a better approach.

我想說的是，我們的做法更多的是對浮動利率貸款設定下限。然後你可能會說，好吧，如果利率低於這些下限，這些貸款就會還清。我認為這是一個我們可以處理的非常明確的問題。我們擁有良好的發起能力，顯然還有談判底線的能力。所以我認為這是一個更好的方法。

Look, I think it's a very difficult -- the reason why it's a very difficult question from my perspective about -- and look, in general, I believe that rates will stabilize or that we're more at the end of the tightening cycle than we're not. But there's also -- it depends on what happens from a fiscal perspective, right? If we had a change where the fiscal stimulation started to come back in, the fighting the Fed which it already has been, right? It's still there. You could end up. I don't think it's -- it would be outside the realm of what should be prepared for that you end up with longer, higher for longer.

聽著，我認為這是一個非常困難的問題——從我的角度來看，這是一個非常困難的問題的原因——總的來說，我相信利率將會穩定下來，或者我們更多地處於緊縮週期的結束階段。不是。但還有——這取決於從財政角度來看會發生什麼，對吧？如果我們有一個改變，財政刺激開始重新出現，與美聯儲的鬥爭已經發生了，對嗎？它還在那裡。你可能會結束。我不認為這超出了你應該準備的範圍，你最終會得到更長、更高、更長的時間。

Now -- and I think we have to prepare for that probability. So I'm not a big fan. I look -- and I get it. I mean, I think you could be the big hero if you did that. But I think what we've decided to do is have shorter duration assets, and we also have the ability to move our -- with a very limited CD book. We have the ability to reprice deposits really quickly. And so we're going to try to manage it more that way rather than try to guess the top of the interest rate cycle. And for clients that want to do it, we'll obviously have the opportunity for them to use the swaps, and they can take advantage of a lower part of the yield curve if they want.

現在——我認為我們必須為這種可能性做好準備。所以我不是它的忠實粉絲。我一看——我明白了。我的意思是，我認為如果你這樣做的話，你可能會成為大英雄。但我認為我們決定做的是擁有較短期限的資產，而且我們也有能力通過非常有限的 CD 書來轉移我們的資產。我們有能力非常快速地重新定價存款。因此，我們將嘗試以這種方式進行管理，而不是嘗試猜測利率週期的頂部。對於想要這樣做的客戶，我們顯然有機會讓他們使用掉期，如果他們願意，他們可以利用收益率曲線的較低部分。

So somebody wants a 10-year fixed rate loan now they can get it at a cheaper price than a variable, right? Fair enough. They can do that here. They're just going to be stuck with that rate, which may not be too bad for 10 years, but it depends on their mindset. So -- but we won't have that. We'll have a variable rate.

那麼有人想要 10 年期固定利率貸款，現在他們可以以比可變利率更便宜的價格獲得貸款，對嗎？很公平。他們可以在這裡做到這一點。他們只會被困在這個利率上，這在十年內可能不會太糟糕，但這取決於他們的心態。所以——但我們不會這樣。我們將採用可變利率。

There are no further questions at this time. I'll hand the floor back to Johnny Lai for closing remarks.

目前沒有其他問題。我將把發言權交回約翰尼·賴 (Johnny Lai) 作結束語。

Great. Thanks for everyone's interest. We'll talk to you next quarter.

偉大的。感謝大家的興趣。我們將在下個季度與您交談。

Thank you. And with that, we conclude today's call. All parties may disconnect.

謝謝。我們今天的電話會議到此結束。所有各方都可以斷開連接。