America Movil SAB de CV (AMX) 2022 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good morning. My name is Nadia, and I'll be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everybody to the América Móvil Fourth Quarter 2022 Conference Call and Webcast. (Operator Instructions) Thank you.

早安.我叫納迪亞，今天我將擔任您的會議主持人。現在，我歡迎大家參加 América Móvil 2022 年第四季電話會議和網路廣播。 （操作員指示）謝謝。

Now I would like to turn the call over to Mr. Daniela Lecuona, Head of Investor Relations.

現在，我想將電話轉給投資者關係主管 Daniela Lecuona 先生。

Thank you. Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us today to discuss our fourth quarter 2022 financial and operating results. We have on the line Mr. Daniel Hajj, CEO; Mr. Carlos Jose Garcia Moreno Elizondo, CFO; and Mr. Oscar Von Hauske Solís, COO.

謝謝。大家早安。感謝您今天加入我們討論我們的 2022 年第四季財務與營運績效。我們的聯絡人是執行長 Daniel Hajj 先生；財務長 Carlos Jose Garcia Moreno Elizondo 先生；以及營運長 Oscar Von Hauske Solís 先生。

Thank you, Daniela. Welcome, everyone, in the fourth quarter '22 financial and operating report, and Carlos is going to make a summary of the results. Thank you, guys.

謝謝你，丹妮拉。歡迎大家，在 22 年第四季的財務和營運報告中，卡洛斯將對結果進行總結。謝謝你們。

Thank you, Daniel. Good morning, everyone. Well, at the beginning of the fourth quarter, uncertainty about inflation and how much bringing it down would require in terms of additional interest rate hikes by the Fed drove long term interest rates in the US to the peak for the year in October at 4.2%. They remain very volatile the rest of the quarter, ending the year at 3.7%.

謝謝你，丹尼爾。大家早安。在第四季初，由於對通膨的不確定性以及聯準會需要升息多少才能將通膨降至最低，美國長期利率在 10 月升至 4.2% 的年內最高水平。本季剩餘時間的波動依然非常大，年底漲幅為 3.7%。

Nonetheless, the impression they had peaked ended up helping several currencies in the region, particularly the Mexican peso and the Chilean peso which appreciated sharply vis-à-vis the dollar with the Colombian peso stopping and then reverting slightly decline of several months. Throughout the period, the Brazilian real remained quite volatile and with no upper end trend as the country was in the midst of our (inaudible) election.

儘管如此，這種印象最終幫助了該地區的幾種貨幣，特別是墨西哥比索和智利比索兌美元大幅升值，而哥倫比亞比索則停止了幾個月的下跌，並略有回升。在整個期間，由於巴西正處於（聽不清楚）選舉之中，因此雷亞爾一直非常不穩定，並且沒有上限趨勢。

We added 3.3 million wireless subscribers in the quarter, of which 1.5 million were postpaid clients. Brazil led the way with 600,000 shops followed by Austria with 22,000 and Colombia with 160,000. Our net gains in prepaid totaled 1.8 million, with Mexico contributing over half of that figure with 975,000 subscribers. Colombia came next with 546,000 and then Central America with 247,000.

本季我們增加了 330 萬無線用戶，其中 150 萬是後付費客戶。巴西擁有 60 萬家門市，位居榜首；其次是奧地利，擁有 22,000 家門市；哥倫比亞擁有 16 萬家門市。我們的預付費淨增用戶總計 180 萬，其中墨西哥用戶數達 975,000 名，佔總用戶的一半以上。緊隨其後的是哥倫比亞，人口為 546,000，然後是中美洲，人口為 247,000。

On the fixed-line platform, we obtained [according 30,000] new broadband access. Argentina and Eastern Europe generated substantially all of them, 69,000 and 40,000, respectively. Central America, the Dominican Republic and Brazil added close to 30,000 each one.

在固定線路平台上，我們獲得了[約30,000]個新的寬頻存取。阿根廷和東歐佔據了絕大部分份額，分別為 69,000 和 40,000。中美洲、多明尼加共和國和巴西各增加了近3 萬人。

Pay TV reverted the losses of several of the last several years with 97,000 new clients. This included 53,000 in Argentina, 36,000 in Eastern Europe and 34,000 in Central America. Although Brazil continued to post net disconnections, they were substantially lower than they had been in prior quarters. Minus 50,000 in the fourth quarter, whereas in previous quarters, they have covered between 150,000 and 200,000 clients.

付費電視挽回了過去幾年的損失，新增了 97,000 名客戶。其中包括阿根廷 53,000 人、東歐 36,000 人以及中美洲 34,000 人。儘管巴西的淨斷電情況持續存在，但已大幅低於前幾季的水準。第四季減少了 50,000 名客戶，而在前幾個季度，他們的客戶數量在 150,000 至 200,000 名之間。

In terms of actual growth rates and correcting for the acquisition of our clients in the second quarter, our postpaid base continued to be the more than align with a 38% increase year-over-year, with prepaid coming next at 4.9%. Including our clients, the excess growth rate at the end of 2022 came in at 8.8% and 6.8%, respectively. These figures already reflect a $4.1 million cleanup of our wireless subscriber base in the quarter to do with former or clients that were not generating traffic. Broadband accesses remained very stable with a 2.4% growth pace. As for Pay TV, there has been a noteworthy shift in the expansion of its client base, which turned positive for the first time in several quarters.

就實際成長率和第二季度客戶獲取的調整而言，我們的後付費基礎持續保持年增 38% 以上，其次是預付費，成長率為 4.9%。如果算上我們的客戶，2022年底的超額成長率分別為8.8%和6.8%。這些數字已經反映了我們本季對無線用戶群進行的 410 萬美元清理，清理內容是針對以前或沒有產生流量的客戶。寬頻存取保持穩定，成長率為2.4%。就付費電視而言，其客戶群的擴張出現了顯著的變化，這是幾個季度以來首次轉為正成長。

Our fourth quarter revenue totaled MXN 216 billion, down 2.4% year-on-year in Mexican peso terms, with service revenue declining 1.4%. The yearly reduction in revenue in Mexican peso terms stems from the appreciation of the Mexican peso vis-a-vis practically all our main operating currencies except the Brazilian trial. At constant exchange rates, correcting for the currency movements mentioned above. Service revenue actually increased 6% year-on-year, which was the same prison the preceding quarter. EBITDA declined 4.4% year-on-year to MXN 4.8 billion in the fourth quarter or MXN 79.6 billion adjusted for ordinary items.

我們第四季的收入總計 2,160 億墨西哥比索，以墨西哥比索計算年減 2.4%，其中服務收入下降 1.4%。以墨西哥比索計算的年度收入減少是由於墨西哥比索兌除巴西雷亞爾以外的幾乎所有主要營運貨幣都升值。以固定匯率計算，修正上述貨幣變動。服務收入實際上同比增長了 6％，與上一季持平。第四季度，EBITDA 年減 4.4% 至 48 億墨西哥比索，經普通項目調整後為 796 億墨西哥比索。

At constant exchange rates, adjusted EBITDA rose 5% as compared to 5.7% precision quarter, 4.6% in the second quarter and 4.8% in the first quarter. The adjusted EBITDA margin remained almost flat at 3.8% year-on-year, a 34 basis point reduction in relation to the year earlier quarter.

以固定匯率計算，調整後 EBITDA 成長 5%，而本季為 5.7%，第二季為 4.6%，第一季為 4.8%。調整後的 EBITDA 利潤率與去年同期相比基本持平，為 3.8%，較去年同期下降 34 個基點。

The adjustments include extraordinary revenue from the sale of towers by Telmex, both in the fourth quarter of 2021 and 2022 and by Peru in the quarter. The reduction in medical costs and property tax rate level and telecom infrastruction in Puerto Rico and the elimination of a provision in the color associated with -- also with payment obligations regarding telecom infrastructure. You can see the numbers here on this slide.

這些調整包括 Telmex 在 2021 年和 2022 年第四季以及秘魯在該季度出售鐵塔所獲得的非經常性收入。波多黎各的醫療費用和財產稅率水準以及電信基礎設施的降低以及與電信基礎設施支付義務相關的顏色規定的取消。您可以在這張投影片上看到這些數字。

On the -- both mobile and fixed line service revenue expanded a similar sale than in the prior quarter. Mobile revenue growth was robust at 9.8%, where site service revenue was slightly positive at 0.2%. -- very similar to the start of the third quarter. On the mobile platform, postpaid service revenue growth at 10.5% stayed strong, but that's on prepaid declined slightly from 9.5% in the third quarter to 8.6% in the fourth one. Brazil posted 22.7% mobile service revenue growth, partly reflecting incorporation of former subscribers.

行動和固定電話服務收入均比上一季有所成長。行動收入強勁成長 9.8%，其中站點服務收入小幅上漲 0.2%。 ——與第三季的開始非常相似。在行動平台上，後付費服務收入成長10.5%，維持強勁，但預付費收入從第三季的9.5%略有下降至第四季的8.6%。巴西行動服務收入成長了22.7％，部分原因是吸收了先前的用戶。

Mexico came in next at 9.1% and then Eastern Europe at 7.3%, and this always move to. As for the fixed-line platform, revenue from both corporate networks and broadband services decelerated from the third quarter from 12.4% to 10.5% in corporate networks and from 3.6% to 2.9% in broadband services. However, pay TV revenue continued its recovery, declining only 3.5% in the fourth quarter, its smallest decline in several quarters.

接下來是墨西哥，佔 9.1%，然後是東歐，佔 7.3%，這比例一直在上升。固網平台方面，企業網及寬頻業務營收佔比均較第三季下降，企業網從第三季的12.4%降至10.5%，寬頻業務營收佔第三季的3.6%降至2.9%。不過，付費電視收入持續復甦，第四季僅下降3.5%，是幾季以來最小的降幅。

Broadband revenue increased faster in Eastern Europe in American Republic and Puerto Rico, all of them close to a 13% pace, with Colombia observing a decline of the same magnitude on account of structure competition. Corporate Networks revenue climbed 10.5% out. Together with postpaid, it was the fastest-growing business line. Eastern Europe, Brazil and Ecuador, standard of the more dynamic ones in this segment. EBITDA growth accelerated in Eastern Europe to 10.7% from 8.6% in prior quarters.

東歐的美洲共和國和波多黎各的寬頻收入成長更快，均接近13％，而哥倫比亞則因結構性競爭而出現同樣幅度的下降。企業網路收入成長了10.5%。它與後付費一起成為成長最快的業務線。東歐、巴西和厄瓜多爾是這一領域較有活力的國家的標準。東歐的 EBITDA 成長率從前幾季的 8.6% 加速至 10.7%。

In Mexico, to 9.4% from 4.3%, more than Bob and in Peru to 5.3% from minus 0.9%. It remains flat in Austria and decelerated to 3.5% from 10.8% in Brazil and to minus 3.7% from minus 0.3% in Colombia. Our operating profit totaled MXN 44.7 billion in the quarter, down 7% in Mexican peso terms as depreciation and amortization charges dropped 1.2%. These incorporate the reduction in related depreciation charges restate spinoff and the increased rights of year depreciation charges arising from the new tower lease obligations. After a comprehensive financing cost of MXN 8.3 billion in the quarter, which was 57% smaller than the one offered the year before, we ended up with a net profit of MXN 23.1 billion from our continued operations, 5.3% greater than that set year before and of MXN 13.3 billion once the effect of the deconsolidation of Claro Chile is taken into account. So again, the net profit of MXN 23 billion from continued operations, which was 5% higher than the prior year.

墨西哥的增幅從 4.3% 上升至 9.4%，高於鮑伯的增幅；秘魯的增幅從 -0.9% 上升至 5.3%。奧地利的成長勢頭保持平穩，巴西的成長勢頭從 10.8% 降至 3.5%，哥倫比亞的成長勢頭從 -0.3% 降至 -3.7%。本季我們的營業利潤總計 447 億墨西哥比索，以墨西哥比索計算下降 7%，因為折舊和攤提費用下降了 1.2%。這些包括重述分拆相關折舊費用的減少和因新塔租賃義務而增加的年度折舊費用。本季綜合融資成本為 83 億墨西哥比索，比去年同期低 57%，但我們最終從持續經營中獲得了 231 億墨西哥比索的淨利潤，比去年同期高出 5.3%，如果考慮到 Claro Chile 拆分的影響，則為 133 億墨西哥比索。因此，持續經營淨利潤為 230 億墨西哥比索，比上年增長 5%。

Our cash flow and net borrowings of MXN 7 billion allowed us to cover capital expenditures in the amount of MXN 160 billion, net shareholder distributions of MXN 50 billion and labor obligations totaling MXN 24 billion. The tower spin of a net acquisition of ownership interest in different assets, including a portion of our mobile clients resulted in a net receipt of MXN 35 billion, which you can see on the slide.

我們的現金流和 70 億墨西哥比索的淨借款使我們能夠支付 1600 億墨西哥比索的資本支出、500 億墨西哥比索的淨股東分配以及總計 240 億墨西哥比索的勞工義務。對不同資產的所有權權益的淨收購，包括我們的部分行動客戶，導致淨收入為 350 億墨西哥比索，您可以在幻燈片中看到。

Excluding leases, our net debt totaled MXN 389 billion year over year. Were down MXN 19 billion relative to the year-end in 2021. Our net debt-to-EBITDA ratio came down to 1.3 at the end of the year.

除去租賃，我們的淨債務總額較去年同期上升了 3,890 億墨西哥比索。與 2021 年底相比下降了 190 億墨西哥比索。

So with that, I will pass the floor back to Daniel. Thank you.

因此，我將發言權交還給丹尼爾。謝謝。

Thank you, Carlos. We can start with the Q&A.

謝謝你，卡洛斯。我們可以從問答環節開始。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question goes to Lucas Chaves of UBS.

（操作員指示）我們的第一個問題是針對瑞銀的盧卡斯查維斯 (Lucas Chaves) 提出的。

And I would like to understand what you have in mining CapEx for the near future, especially considering 5G and how that would affect shareholder distribution? And if I may ask a second question on Mexico, if you could give us more detail on the mobile strategy adopted during the quarter, mostly to understand the strategy going forward in prepaid plans and if the space of addition is going to continue going forward?

我想了解您近期在採礦業的資本支出情況，尤其是考慮到 5G，以及這將如何影響股東分配？我可以問第二個關於墨西哥的問題，您能否向我們詳細介紹本季採用的行動策略，主要是為了了解預付費計畫的未來策略，以及未來是否會繼續增加成長空間？

Thank you. First question on the CapEx. What we said last year is that we're going to have a $24 billion CapEx for the next 3 years. And I think it's the target that we have. That includes frequencies. And last year, I think we do 7.9%. So this year, our target is around 8.2% to because we have something last year that we're going to put this year. But -- and what I said 1 or 2 years ago is that 5G did not increase a lot of CapEx because what we have been doing is investing in 5G. So we have put the basis with a fiber to the node. A lot of the things that 5G needs. So the only thing that we need to put to increase and to do 5G more the radio, okay?

謝謝。第一個問題是關於資本支出的。我們去年說過，未來三年我們將有 240 億美元的資本支出。我認為這是我們的目標。其中包括頻率。去年，我認為我們的成長率為 7.9%。所以今年我們的目標是 8.2% 左右，因為去年我們有一些目標，今年我們會把這個目標達成。但是——我一兩年前就說過，5G 並沒有增加很多資本支出，因為我們一直在投資 5G。因此，我們已經將光纖連接到節點作為基礎。 5G 需要的很多東西。所以我們唯一需要做的就是增加 5G 無線電，好嗎？

A little bit on NFV and some of the other things that we need a little in our network. We have been investing in our networks and moderate nice. So it's not something that -- what we're targeting for this year is to increase our fiber in some places. We're seeing some opportunities in some countries doing more fiber and increasing our fixed broadband, and that's more or less where we're going to focus. We're going to focus on the digitalization of all the company to save cost. We have been doing that for the last 5 years, and that's something that we are doing. So more digital, more everything more new and the cutting costs you have to invest to do better systems, IT. So that's more or less where we're investing. Our target is MXN 24 billion in 3 years, and we are on that.

關於 NFV 和我們網路中需要的一些其他東西。我們一直在投資我們的人脈並且適度友善。所以，我們今年的目標並不是在某些地方增加光纖。我們看到一些國家有機會鋪設更多的光纖並增加固定寬頻，這或多或少就是我們將要關注的重點。我們將致力於整個公司的數位化，以節省成本。過去五年來我們一直在這樣做，這就是我們正在做的事情。因此，數位化程度越來越高，一切都越來越新，你必須削減成本來投資建立更好的系統和 IT。基本上這就是我們所投資的地方。我們的目標是 3 年內賺取 240 億墨西哥比索，我們正在實現這個目標。

On Mexico, what's your question specifically on Mexico?

關於墨西哥，您對墨西哥具體有什麼問題？

It's more to understand this strategy regarding the mobile strategy, especially in the net additions in prepaid, if this space is going to continue going forward?

多了解行動策略，尤其是預付費的淨增量，這個領域是否會繼續向前發展？

On Mexico, I think we're doing good. We have around 100 cities in 5G as the -- we are in a very good position in 5G. I think our competitors really -- they are not competing in 5G. We have a good quantity, good name, good distribution, good top of mine in Mexico. So we are doing good. We are growing. We are growing in prepaid a loss. In the 2020 with the pandemia (sic) [pandemic] think the postpaid subscribers decreased a little bit, but this year, last year 2022 start to grow again.

在墨西哥問題上，我認為我們做得很好。我們在 5G 領域已涵蓋約 100 個城市，在 5G 領域我們處於非常有利的地位。我認為我們的競爭對手實際上並沒有在 5G 領域中競爭。我們在墨西哥的礦井數量充足，聲譽良好，分佈良好，品質優良。因此我們做得很好。我們正在成長。我們的預付損失正在增加。 2020 年，由於疫情，後付費用戶數量有所減少，但今年和去年（2022 年）又開始成長。

And this quarter, we have 60,000 good, we feel we're doing also very good in postpaid. we have a good strategy. We are with a very good name in the market, and that's good. What is happening a little bit is in 2020, the wireless fixed wireless, we grow a lot in the fixed wireless because people stay at home and needs internet. And that is becoming -- is reducing as we're having disconnections on that because a lot of companies and Telmex is putting fiber. So they are disconnecting a little bit the fixed wireless. But in the normal one we are growing also the goods. So that's more or less what we have been seeing. So that's -- people is starting to move. They need a phone, they need 5G, and they are not staying at home. So they are, let's say, moving from the wireless in peak from the wireless Internet to a mobile Internet. So that's what we have been seeing in the last 6 months.

本季度，我們的銷量為 60,000 輛，我們認為我們在後付費方面的表現也非常好。我們有一個很好的策略。我們在市場上享有很高的聲譽，這很好。 2020 年將會發生一些變化，無線固定無線方面，我們將在固定無線方面獲得很大的發展，因為人們留在家裡，需要網路。由於許多公司和 Telmex 正在鋪設光纖，我們因此出現了斷線現象，這種情況正在減少。因此他們正在稍微斷開固定無線網路。但在正常情況下，我們也在種植農產品。這或多或少就是我們所看到的。這就是──人們開始行動了。他們需要一部手機，他們需要 5G，而且他們不會待在家裡。因此，可以說，他們正從無線網路的巔峰轉向行動網路。這就是我們在過去六個月中所看到的情況。

And the next question goes to Alejandro Gallostra of BBVA.

下一個問題是針對 BBVA 的 Alejandro Gallostra 提出的。

I would like to ask you about the fixed line business strategy in Brazil. You've been reporting consistently good results on your broadband business and also in your corporate segment in Brazil. But somehow, the voice and the Pay TV segments continue to drag down results and you continue reporting a small decline in this fixed-line business. So I'd like to understand why this is happening despite the strong FTTH deployment that you're implementing in the country. How are you seeing the competition? Or why this is happening and when we should expect to see a turnaround in this fixed line business in Brazil -- this is my first question.

我想問您關於巴西固定電話業務策略的問題。你們的寬頻業務以及巴西的公司部門一直都取得了良好的表現。但不知何故，語音和付費電視部分繼續拖累業績，並且固定電話業務繼續出現小幅下滑。因此，我想了解為什麼儘管你們國家已經實施了強大的 FTTH 部署，但仍然會發生這種情況。您如何看待此次競爭？或者為什麼會發生這種情況以及我們什麼時候可以預期巴西固定電話業務會好轉——這是我的第一個問題。

Well, as you mentioned, when you look at the revenues on fixed volume, we are growing 5.5%. Let me comment that we did in the prior conference calls, looking at the network, all the cable network is already prepared for DOCSIS 3.1. So we could deliver 1 gigabit speed in all of the cable network. And as you mentioned, we've been building fiber to the home. We are not last year with close to 8 million home passes with fiber to the home. And we will continue to do that. So -- and we see a very good month on December on the net asset program. We were really positive on that side. I think the landscape is changing with the ISPs and all the environment that we saw in the last years but as you mentioned, voice is declining and is declining everywhere. I mean it's difficult now is a substitution through the mobile or to different sources of IP voice.

嗯，正如您所說，當您查看固定量的收入時，我們的成長幅度為 5.5%。讓我評論一下，我們在之前的電話會議中確實做過調查，查看了網絡，所有有線電視網絡都已為 DOCSIS 3.1 做好了準備。因此我們可以在整個有線網路中提供 1千兆的速度。正如您所說，我們一直在建造光纖到府。去年，我們已有近 800 萬戶家庭接入了光纖到府。我們將繼續這樣做。因此 — — 我們看到 12 月份的淨資產計劃表現得非常好。我們對此非常積極。我認為隨著 ISP 和我們在過去幾年看到的所有環境的改變，情況正在發生變化，但正如您所說，語音正在衰落，而且在各個方面都在衰落。我的意思是，現在的困難是透過行動裝置或不同的 IP 語音來源進行替代。

And in Pay TV, when you look at the decline, we are half of the decline that we saw in the clear quarters and has been working pretty net new, let's call it, the new TV. So we call app Claro and Claro (inaudible). They are working pretty good, of course, not enough to compensate the decline, but it's -- we believe that it's a good trend to compensate the decline on Pay TV. On corporate, we mentioned before, we have a very good year and different value-added services. When I mention value-added services, we are running pretty good in cloud services in new vertical solutions in the market in a chat bot that includes machine learning and artificial intel.

而在付費電視方面，當你看到下滑趨勢時，你會發現我們的下滑幅度只有淨營收季度下滑的一半，而且一直保持著相當不錯的淨營收，我們稱之為「新電視」。因此我們將該應用程式命名為 Claro 和 Claro（聽不清楚）。當然，它們的效果相當不錯，但還不足以彌補下滑，但我們相信，這是彌補付費電視下滑的好趨勢。關於公司，我們之前提到過，今年我們的業績非常好，並且推出了不同的增值服務。當我提到增值服務時，我們在市場上新的垂直解決方案中的雲端服務以及包括機器學習和人工智慧的聊天機器人方面運作得相當好。

So we feel that we have the right organization to get a good position on the corporate market. So branded all, I think the revenues were good and the EBITDA in Brazil as well. But we will continue to do that. We will do, as I mentioned, more fiber in the country. And another thing that I forgot to mention is that fixed broadband speed is relevant. No question is at more relevant is availability of the network, time to repair. So we've been working how we do the best customer experience in the market. We are #1 in ultrabroadband in the country. And we are working to reduce the churn. And when you look at the last quarter, the churn was really good against the previous quarters because we are working as well in all customer experience around fixed broaden and all the services.

因此，我們認為我們擁有正確的組織結構，能夠在企業市場上佔據良好地位。因此，我認為所有品牌的收入都很好，巴西的 EBITDA 也很好。但我們會繼續這樣做。正如我所提到的，我們將在該國生產更多的光纖。還有一件事我忘了提，那就是固定寬頻速度也很重要。毫無疑問，更相關的是網路的可用性和修復時間。因此，我們一直在努力提供市場上最好的客戶體驗。我們在超寬頻領域在全國排名第一。我們正在努力減少客戶流失。回顧上個季度，你會發現客戶流失率與前幾季相比確實表現不錯，因為我們在圍繞固定擴展和所有服務的所有客戶體驗方面做得非常好。

Well, I think in Brazil, just to make a summary of what Oscar is saying. I think in Brazil, we are expecting a better this year than last year in terms of broadband and in terms of the TV subscribers market and everything. So I think it's a good opportunity this year on Brazil on segment of the market.

好吧，我認為是在巴西，只是對奧斯卡所說的話做一個總結。我認為，在巴西，我們預計今年的寬頻、電視用戶市場等各方面都會比去年更好。因此我認為今年對巴西市場來說是一個很好的機會。

Well, I think in Brazil, just to make a summary of what Oscar is saying. I think in Brazil, we are expecting a better this year than last year in terms of broadband and in terms of the TV subscribers market and everything. So I think it's a good opportunity this year on Brazil on segment of the market.

好吧，我認為是在巴西，只是對奧斯卡所說的話做一個總結。我認為，在巴西，我們預計今年的寬頻、電視用戶市場等各方面都會比去年更好。因此我認為今年對巴西市場來說是一個很好的機會。

We have talked with a lot of them until today, we haven't closed anything in Brazil. So no comment on that. Still no comment on that. We're open depending on the conditions. But until today, we don't have anything close.

到目前為止，我們已經與很多人進行了交談，但我們在巴西尚未達成任何協議。因此對此不予置評。對此仍無評論。根據情況我們是否開放。但直到今天，我們還沒有任何接近的進展。

My second question is regarding the 5G technology. I would like to hear from you what's been your experience with the 5G deployment. It's been a few quarters since you already started deploying this technology in the region. And I'd like to hear from you what you expect to get out of this technology going forward -- and maybe more specifically, I know what's been your experience with the customers using this technology. Do you believe that you are willing to pay a premium for using this technology, and therefore, we should expect an increase in revenues and ARPUs going forward as you continue deploying this technology. And also maybe even given the increased efficiency of the 5G technology, maybe we should expect continued improvement in margins going forward.

我的第二個問題是關於5G技術的。我想聽聽您對 5G 部署的體驗。您已經開始在該地區部署這項技術了。我還想聽聽您對未來從這項技術中得到什麼的期望，更具體地說，我知道您與使用這項技術的客戶打交道的體驗如何。您是否相信您願意為使用這項技術支付額外費用，因此，隨著您繼續部署這項技術，我們應該預期未來的收入和 ARPU 會增加。而且也許考慮到 5G 技術效率的提高，我們或許應該預期未來利潤率會持續提高。

We maybe these efficiencies should be offset by the higher operating expenses driven by the increased number of towers that you should be ramping in order to deploy this technology. So overall, how should we think about the 5G deployment going forward? What should be the impact in revenues, ARPUs and profitability going forward, given your experience so far?

我們或許認為這些效率應該被更高的營運費用所抵消，而為了部署這項技術，您應該增加塔的數量。那麼整體而言，我們應該如何看待未來的5G部署？根據您目前的經驗，這對未來的收入、ARPU 和獲利能力會產生什麼影響？

It's a very good question. It's difficult to explain everything. But the thing that I can tell you is that on Mexico that we have been deployed 100 cities, and it was our first city, well, also Austria. Austria and Mexico. Brazil is going also in a good pace. The ARPUs have been growing. In Mexico, ARPU grow. Let me (inaudible) around 6%, and a lot of that in postpaid is because 5G is 5G is helping us to grow that. I think the experience with the people is good. I think the speeds are okay. People is using more (inaudible) touch of use. And well, you need to do a lot of work to optimize the network because then you are running 3G, 4G, 5G. So there's a lot of things that you need to do.

這是一個非常好的問題。很難解釋一切。但我可以告訴你的是，在墨西哥，我們已經部署了 100 個城市，這是我們的第一個城市，還有奧地利。奧地利和墨西哥。巴西隊也正在以良好的步伐前進。 ARPU 一直在增長。在墨西哥，ARPU 增長。讓我（聽不清楚）大約 6%，其中很大一部分是後付費，因為 5G 正在幫助我們成長。我認為與人民的體驗很好。我覺得速度還可以。人們正在更多地使用（聽不清楚）觸摸方式。你需要做大量工作來優化網絡，因為你正在運行 3G、4G、5G。所以你需要做很多事情。

As you said, it's more efficient 5G than 4G. So there's a lot more handsets with 5G than we have last year. So there is a lot of things coming. And I think it's a good technology. It's more efficient, as you said. So it doesn't make any sense to put only 4G, if you can have 5G. If you -- as I said a few minutes ago, if you do all the work on all the investments that you need to do fiber to the node, electronics and a lot of things in the core also to deploy 5G. In the other side, that's the massive market, okay?

正如你所說，5G比4G更有效率。因此，今年的 5G 手機數量比去年多得多。因此，有很多事情會發生。我認為這是一項很好的技術。正如您所說，它更有效率。因此，如果可以使用 5G，那麼只使用 4G 就沒有意義了。正如我幾分鐘前所說的那樣，如果您完成了部署 5G 所需的所有投資工作，包括光纖到節點、電子設備以及核心中的許多東西。另一方面，這是一個巨大的市場，好嗎？

In the corporate market, I think there's a lot of new applications that we're going to sell. There's a lot of things, internet of things, things connected and it's starting to go on and on. And I think that's not all to model, but for the next 5 years, I can tell you that we're going to have millions of things connected in the corporate side and a lot of new applications in that. So we're happy deploying 5G. I think it's profitable for us deploying 5G and the people like 5G.

在企業市場，我認為我們將要銷售許多新的應用程式。有很多東西，物聯網，萬物互聯，而且這一切都還在不斷發生。我認為這還不是全部的模型，但在接下來的 5 年裡，我可以告訴你，我們將在企業方面連接數百萬個事物，並在其中產生大量新的應用程式。因此我們很高興部署5G。我認為，對我們來說，部署5G是有利可圖的，人們也喜歡5G。

So there's a little bit of advertising, a little bit of more speed, a little bit of applications. There's a lot of things. And the other applications that I think is working very good in the U.S. is the 5G with fixed broadband, fixed broadband wireless in 5G. I think it's another application that is going well. And in places where you are not going to have fiber, I think it's very competitive. It's a very good product and I think the CPs are reducing the prices. So we're going to start to put more and more of this.

因此，有一點廣告，有一點速度，有一點應用程式。有很多事情。我認為在美國運作良好的其他應用是5G與固定寬頻、5G中的固定寬頻無線。我認為這是另一個進展順利的應用程式。在沒有光纖的地方，我認為競爭非常激烈。這是一個非常好的產品，我認為 CP 正在降低價格。因此我們將開始投入越來越多的這類內容。

In Austria, we have a lot of that. And it because, let's say, young people does not want to call us for fiber connected. So what they do is they buy the 5G model. And then if they change home or they change place, they take it with them. And it's very easy for them, good speed, and it's working very good. So there's a lot of things that around 5G and it's working for us, definitely is working.

在奧地利，我們有很多這樣的情況。這是因為，比如說，年輕人不願意打電話給我們要求連接光纖。所以他們買了5G型號。如果他們換家或換地方，他們也會把它帶走。對他們來說這非常容易，速度很快，而且效果很好。所以有很多事情與 5G 有關，而且它對我們有用，絕對是有用的。

(Operator Instructions) And our next question goes to Walter Piecyk of LightShed Partners.

（操作員指示）我們的下一個問題是針對 LightShed Partners 的 Walter Piecyk 提出的。

Carlos, thanks for providing the constant currency growth in service revenue. Was there also any type of onetime counter entry to what you report in service revenue? I know sometimes there's like intercompany eliminations or anything in that service revenue line that might have reduced it relative beyond currency, which you also obviously put in your press release.

卡洛斯，感謝您提供服務收入的持續貨幣成長。您在報告服務收入時是否也包含任何類型的一次性計數器分錄？我知道有時服務收入線上存在類似公司間抵銷或其他任何因素，可能會使其相對貨幣收入降低，你顯然也在新聞稿中提到了這一點。

And maybe if you can give us some sense of in constant currency terms, what you think service revenue growth will look like for 2023.

或許您可以告訴我們，以固定匯率計算，您認為 2023 年的服務收入成長將會是怎樣的。

Well, I think it's been quite consistent with the revenue growth. It has been accelerating through the year as we saw in one of the slides. And I think it has been stable at about 6% for 2 quarters, having increased from about 4% at the beginning of the year. And I think that the underlying trends point to growth remaining in the range, which is way higher than what we had mentioned at the Investor Day a bit more than a year ago. We're looking at 2.5% to 4% service revenue growth, and we've been delivering 6% over the last 2, 3 quarters.

嗯，我認為這與收入成長相當一致。正如我們在一張幻燈片中看到的那樣，這一成長趨勢在今年一直在加速。我認為，這個數字已經連續兩季穩定在 6% 左右，較年初的 4% 左右有所上升。我認為，基本趨勢表明成長仍將保持在這一範圍內，這遠高於我們一年多前在投資者日提到的水平。我們預計服務收入將成長 2.5% 至 4%，過去 2 至 3 個季度的成長率已達到 6%。

So I think at present, we estimate that we are going to be continuing with this kind of service revenue growth. And we have nothing exceptional in terms of revenues. So what you see in all the results that we have in the reported countries, all the intercompany transactions are eliminated, so they cancelled out. So there's really no noise in the results from intercompany transactions at all.

因此我認為目前我們估計我們將繼續這種服務收入成長。就收入而言，我們並沒有什麼特別之處。因此，您在我們報告的所有國家/地區的結果中看到的是，所有公司間交易都被消除了，因此它們被抵消了。因此，公司間交易的結果中其實根本沒有任何噪音。

Maybe it's just a math on how we're calculating that conversion. And then Carlos, obviously, the move in the currency has helped the debt leverage relative to the EBITDA. When you think about capital return, who knows how sustained currency moves are going to be, but like -- but how do you think about that internally when currency helps your net debt leverage are you willing to pounce in that quarter to add additional share repurchase? Or do you wait some period of time to see kind of where currencies will ultimately end up?

也許這只是我們如何計算轉換的數學問題。然後卡洛斯，顯然，貨幣的變動有助於提高相對於 EBITDA 的債務槓桿率。當您考慮資本回報時，誰知道貨幣變動將會持續多久，但是——但是當貨幣幫助您的淨債務槓桿時，您在內部是如何考慮的，您是否願意在那個季度增加額外的股票回購？還是您要等待一段時間來觀察貨幣最終的走向？

I think that most of the (inaudible) is really in peso. And so Mexican peso represent a larger share of the -- of our EBITDA. I don't believe that the returns or the distributions will be determined really by the currencies. I mean we've been accustomed to currencies all over the place. And what we are saying is anything going forward, is a strengthening of all the other currencies that have been depreciating in light of higher interest rates and to the extent that this -- from perception that inflation has peaked, I think that we will continue to see currencies like the Brazilian Real appreciate, and we think we will continue to see the Chilean peso appreciated the Colombian peso.

我認為大部分（聽不清楚）實際上是比索。因此，墨西哥比索在我們的 EBITDA 中佔有較大的份額。我不相信回報或分配確實由貨幣決定。我的意思是我們已經習慣了各地的貨幣。我們所說的是，未來的發展是，所有其他因利率上升而貶值的貨幣將走強，而且從通膨已達到頂峰的角度來看，我認為我們將繼續看到巴西雷亞爾等貨幣升值，我們認為我們將繼續看到智利比索和哥倫比亞比索升值。

So I think most of the currencies in the region will be gaining strength over the next few quarters. And I think the main a peso will remain also quite strong. But I don't see that really affecting our distributions. I think the EBITDA -- the leverage ratio, I think, is going to be -- remain fairly stable, around 1.3%, 1.4% as noted to EBITDA throughout the year.

因此我認為該地區的大多數貨幣在未來幾季都會走強。我認為主要比索仍將保持強勢。但我並不認為這確實會影響我們的分佈。我認為 EBITDA（槓桿率）將保持相當穩定，約為 1.3%、全年 EBITDA 為 1.4%。

If you don't mind, just sneaking one more in for Daniel, you talked a lot about 5G and consumers buying phones. But in last year, in the United States, people -- the replacement cycle was getting longer. People were taking longer to replace their phones even though 5G was available. I'm just curious, when you look at your markets in 2023, do you think people will be upgrading their phones more frequently or follow the same trends that we're seeing in the U.S.

如果您不介意的話，我想再偷偷問丹尼爾，您談了很多關於 5G 和消費者購買手機的問題。但去年，在美國，人們的更換週期越來越長。儘管已經有 5G 可用，但人們更換手機的時間仍然更長。我只是好奇，當你展望 2023 年的市場時，你認為人們會更頻繁地升級手機還是會遵循我們在美國看到的相同趨勢？

I think last year and maybe 2022, definitely, there's a lack of handsets, so chips and concepts. So I think they don't replace as often because of that, maybe 2021, a little bit also 2022, I think today, we have enough handsets. But people -- what's happening and what we're seeing, people is choosing a better high handset in Latin America, a higher price handsets. But as you said, they are replacing that a little bit longer. It's what we are seeing a little bit, they choose a 5G. 5G phones are available $250 $020 right now. So there is a good prices for 5G handsets.

我認為去年以及可能到 2022 年，肯定會缺少手機，因此缺少晶片和概念。因此我認為他們不會經常更換，也許到 2021 年，或者到 2022 年，我認為今天，我們有足夠的手機。但是人們——正在發生的事情和我們看到的是，在拉丁美洲人們選擇更好的高階手機，更高價格的手機。但正如你所說，他們更換它的時間要稍長一些。這就是我們所看到的，他們選擇了5G。目前 5G 手機售價為 250 美元至 200 美元。因此5G手機的價格不錯。

So for us, it's good if people delay a little bit the replacement. So it's longer what they say. And I think it's good mostly in all places we have been selling. We are not subsidizing anymore in Latin America, some places, yes, other ones no. But I think it's good if people stay a little bit longer with the handset. So I'm working that all around Latin America.

因此對我們來說，如果人們稍微延遲更換，那是件好事。所以他們說的話已經不再是事實了。而且我認為，在我們銷售的所有地方，它都表現得很好。我們不再對拉丁美洲提供補貼，有些地方提供，有些地方則沒有。但我認為，如果人們能再使用一段時間手機，那就更好了。所以我在整個拉丁美洲開展這項工作。

And the next question goes to Alejandro Azar of GBM.

下一個問題請問 GBM 的 Alejandro Azar。

My question is on value creation and especially on tower announcements in congrats on the announcement on Telekom Austria. My first one is on that front and down the road on your stake in Telekom Austria. Should we think that you could monetize part of that stake. And on your tower business in Latin America, how many towers does AMX you have on the balance? And if you're planning to divest some of them in the next 1, 2 years. And the third one, if I may, also value creation is on the possibility of seeing monetization of other infrastructure assets, perhaps PVA of your network in Mexico.

我的問題是關於價值創造，尤其是關於塔樓公告，祝賀奧地利電信的公告。我的第一個問題與此有關，以及關於你在奧地利電信的股份。我們是否應該認為您可以將部分股份貨幣化。就您在拉丁美洲的塔式業務而言，AMX 總共擁有多少座塔式業務？如果您計劃在未來 1 到 2 年內剝離其中一些資產。第三個，如果可以的話，價值創造也在於看到其他基礎設施資產的貨幣化的可能性，也許是墨西哥網路的 PVA。

Well, the tower assets, remember, we do Latin sites, and we've seen of that last year. I think we still have Colombia and Peru, and we are planning to do Peru, as we said already that we're going to do Peru this year, we're still reviewing what it's going to be -- yes, in the next month to do Peru. -- and the only towers that we still have are Colombia. So those are the only ones in Austria. In Austria, the only thing that we do is we are -- we authorized the spinoff of -- so we want to work on the spinoff of the towers of Austria.

嗯，記住，塔資產是我們的拉丁網站，去年我們已經看到了這一點。我認為我們還有哥倫比亞和秘魯，我們計劃去秘魯，正如我們已經說過的，我們今年要去秘魯，我們仍在審查將會是什麼——是的，下個月去秘魯。 ——目前我們只剩下哥倫比亞的一座塔了。因此，這些是奧地利僅有的。在奧地利，我們唯一做的事情就是 - 我們授權分拆 - 所以我們希望致力於奧地利塔樓的分拆。

These towers are going to be, I think, listed in Austria, planning to be listed in Austria, but we're going to remain with the shares that we already have. And I think the government of us is going to stay also with that. So we are not planning to take it out to the market. So at the beginning, we're going to stay like this only outside of Telekom Austria, and that's what we're planning to do, still a lot of work and a lot of authorizations, but that's what we have been discussing and what we're going to work to do in the next months.

我認為這些塔將在奧地利上市，並計劃在奧地利上市，但我們將繼續持有現有的股份。我認為我們政府也會堅持這一點。因此我們不打算將其推向市場。所以一開始，我們只會在奧地利電信之外保持這種狀態，這就是我們計劃要做的，仍然有很多工作要做，還有很多授權，但這就是我們一直在討論的，也是我們在接下來的幾個月裡要做的事情。

No, I don't think we are thinking to sell any other infrastructure in Latin America at this moment. We are okay. I think it's -- we have a lot of fiber, but we are not planning to sell any of our fiber in Latin America and Europe. And also in Europe, we are not thinking on selling that. I think it's a good asset. We want to use it. We want to penetrate. We want to have more subscribers. And on the other side, we're going to do more fiber to the home fiber to the core fiber. We're going to put more fiber. Part of the CapEx of this year is to put more fiber through Europe and Latin America and Mexico.

不，我認為我們目前沒有考慮出售拉丁美洲的任何其他基礎設施。我們還好。我認為——我們有很多光纖，但我們不打算在拉丁美洲和歐洲銷售任何光纖。而且在歐洲，我們也沒有考慮到銷售該產品。我認為這是一筆寶貴的財富。我們想用它。我們想要滲透。我們希望擁有更多的訂閱者。另一方面，我們將建造更多的光纖到府、光纖到核心光纖。我們會添加更多的纖維。今年資本支出的一部分將用於向歐洲、拉丁美洲和墨西哥輸送更多光纖。

Just to clarify, the only towers that AMX and Telmex have on balance sheet are the Colombian ones?

需要澄清的是，AMX 和 Telmex 資產負債表上唯一的塔是哥倫比亞的嗎？

See, I don't know if Telmex has something still there, but really the country Mexico, Telmex, Mexico as fast a lot of towers, the we've been enough like, I don't know, 6 years ago. Then light-scale CFOs Latin America, was pinning around 40,000 sites last August. I think we do that last August. And there are still 2 countries where we don't have. We just do the Dominican Republic this month and still Peru and Colombia are the ones that we have. Peru, we're planning to do that. And Colombia still we don't have any plan to do that. And still, maybe we have something in Telmex, but it should be very small, not so big.

看，我不知道 Telmex 是否還在那裡，但實際上墨西哥這個國家，Telmex，墨西哥建了很多塔，我們已經足夠了，就像，我不知道，6 年前。去年 8 月，拉丁美洲的小規模 CFO 擁有約 4 萬個站點。我想我們去年八月就這麼做了。還有 2 個國家我們還沒有。本月我們剛造訪了多明尼加共和國，此外我們也造訪了秘魯和哥倫比亞。秘魯，我們正計劃這麼做。而哥倫比亞我們仍沒有這樣做的計劃。而且，也許我們在 Telmex 有一些股份，但它應該很小，不會很大。

Our next question goes to Carlos de Legarreta of Itau.

我們的下一個問題是針對伊塔烏的卡洛斯德勒加雷塔 (Carlos de Legarreta) 提出的。

I have a couple of questions here. The first one is fixed-line in Mexico, you have some disconnections in the quarter in broadband. Have you noticed a tighter competitive environment that your competitors expand their networks? And if you can disclose how many home passed with fiber do you have by the end of the year, that would be great.

我有幾個問題。第一個是墨西哥的固定電話，本季寬頻出現了一些斷線現象。您是否注意到競爭對手的擴張網絡使得競爭環境更加激烈？如果您可以透露今年年底有多少家庭鋪設了光纖，那就太好了。

No, as you know, Telmex has been narrating the customer from copper reset to fiber. Within last year with 67% of the customers already connected with fiber and we will continue to grow that through the next year. So now 67% of the base of Telmex is already connected with fiber. And we will continue to do that migration this year. So we are expecting to increase that 67% higher within this year.

不，如您所知，Telmex 一直在指導客戶從銅線重置為光纖。去年已有 67％ 的客戶接入光纖，明年這數字還會持續成長。目前 Telmex 的 67% 基地台已經連接光纖。今年我們將繼續進行這項遷移。因此我們預計今年這一數字將上升至 67%。

I think what we have been doing in fiber in Mexico has been good for Telmex. I think we're migrating copper to fiber. We're doing a lot more home passes. A big part of what we do is Mexico, Mexico well employed. We're going to deploy also a lot of we're not disclosing how many in each country, but Mexico is with a very good plan on deploying fiber, replacing copper and doing greenfield new areas. reviews in other places. So that's more or less what we have been doing.

我認為我們在墨西哥光纖領域的努力對 Telmex 來說是件好事。我認為我們正在從銅線遷移到光纖。我們正在製作更多回家的通行證。我們所做的很大一部分是為墨西哥服務，為墨西哥提供良好的就業。我們也將部署大量的網絡，但我們不會透露每個國家的具體數量，但墨西哥在部署光纖、替代銅線和開闢綠地新區域方面有著非常好的計劃。其他地方的評論。這或多或少就是我們一直在做的事情。

Competition is very, very tough. In Mexico, prices are very competitive and what we need is to compete more and to do what to work and give good speed, good experience to the customer seen add more value to our offer, and that's what we are doing.

競爭非常非常激烈。在墨西哥，價格競爭非常激烈，我們需要的是加強競爭力，盡力為客戶提供良好的速度和體驗，從而為我們的報價增加更多價值，而這正是我們正在做的事情。

And 2 quick follow-ups. Just the first one on the timing for the stock conversion. It's a single series, if you have any timing for that? And lastly, if you can please disclose the proceed you will receive from the tower sale in the Dominican Republic.

以及 2 個快速後續行動。這是關於股票轉換時間的第一個問題。這是一部單系列劇，您有時間安排嗎？最後，請您透露從多明尼加共和國的塔樓銷售中獲得的收益。

I think on the shares depending on the CNBV, but I think it's not going to take too long. I hope we can do it in this quarter as the February, March, but we don't know. It doesn't depend on authorization. All the papers are submitted. So we're waiting for that. And on the Dominican Republic, we don't disclose those numbers, but we already do around 3000 -- I remember, it's around 3,000 towers now what Dominican Republic has. I don't - Daniela can give you exactly the number, but we're not disclosing country by country. So we're already doing like a spinoff of everything sailing something has been not in other ones, and that's what we have been doing. But you can get 3000…

我認為股票取決於 CNBV，但我認為這不會花費太長時間。我希望我們能在本季度，例如二月、三月完成，但我們不知道。它不依賴授權。所有文件均已提交。所以我們正在等待這一點。至於多明尼加共和國，我們沒有透露這些數字，但我們已經擁有大約 3,000 座基地台——我記得，多明尼加共和國現在大約有 3,000 座基地台。我不知道——丹妮拉可以給你確切的數字，但我們不會透露每個國家的具體數字。因此，我們已經在做一些航海業務的衍生品，有些業務是其他業務中所沒有的，這就是我們一直在做的事情。但你可以得到3000......

I'll talk to Daniela, for sure.

我一定會和丹妮拉談談。

I think -- sorry, not 3,000 are 1,400 towers what we sell in Dominican Republic.

我認為——抱歉，我們在多明尼加共和國銷售的塔不是 3,000 座，而是 1,400 座。

And our next question goes to Cesar Medina of Morgan Stanley.

我們的下一個問題是針對摩根士丹利的 Cesar Medina 提出的。

It relates to shareholder distributions and cash flows. So if I understood correctly the comments that Carlos was mentioning. You have MXN 8 billion to MXN 8.2 billion in CapEx and then leverage is supposed to be roughly stable. I'm assuming you went through your budget process, or maybe you can give us an indication of the building blocks or the free cash flow generation that you have? And what does that mean for directionally speaking, the amount of dividends and potential buybacks that you can do this year relative to 2022?

它與股東分配和現金流有關。如果我正確理解了卡洛斯提到的評論的話。您的資本支出為 80 億到 82 億墨西哥比索，因此槓桿率應該大致穩定。我假設您已經完成了預算流程，或者您可以向我們介紹您擁有的基礎要素或自由現金流生成？從方向上來說，這意味著什麼？ 相對於 2022 年，今年可以進行的股利和潛在回購金額是多少？

Well, the building go forward with the same. So M&A, we have nothing that we are considering in terms of new acquisitions for the year past. And we will continue to have some income coming from the sale of Crackdown because there is a part of the earnout is still taking place this year. And therefore, there will be some amount that will be coming in. So slightly positive on that front. Then on leverage, which has come up before, I mentioned, we don't expect to be less than 1.3x, which is where we are today. Probably 1.3 to 1.4% total we would like to be in terms of the leverage ratio. And I think that very much defines what's left for distributions. No leakage on M&A. Obviously, Daniel has already mentioned the CapEx, which is a relatively flattish compared to last year, a minor increments for this year. And that's about it.

嗯，大樓繼續按照原樣建設。因此，在併購方面，我們在過去的一年裡沒有考慮任何新的收購。我們將繼續從《Crackdown》的銷售中獲得一些收入，因為部分獲利支出今年仍在進行中。因此，會有一些金額流入。然後關於槓桿率，我之前提到過，我們預計不會低於 1.3 倍，也就是我們現在的水平。就槓桿率而言，我們希望的總體水準是 1.3% 到 1.4%。我認為這很大程度上定義了剩餘的分佈。併購方面無任何洩漏。顯然，丹尼爾已經提到了資本支出，與去年相比，資本支出相對持平，今年略有增加。就是這樣了。

And then for the rest of working capital, any comments on that front?

那麼對於剩餘的營運資金，您對此有什麼評論嗎？

I think working capital is very cyclical in this company. We require a lot of working capital in the first quarter, and then we'll start getting it back over the rest of the year, okay? So it's very, very cyclical. But the increase year-on-year on growth in capital is relatively small and is linked to the overall growth of the company.

我認為這家公司的營運資本具有很強的周期性。我們在第一季需要大量的營運資金，然後我們會在今年剩餘時間內開始收回這些資金，好嗎？所以它具有很強的周期性。但資本年增率相對較小，且與公司整體成長掛鉤。

Our next question goes to Phani Kanumuri of HSBC.

我們的下一個問題是請問匯豐銀行的 Phani Kanumuri。

So my question is regarding the pricing power for AMX. So among the major markets, which are the markets where you're able to increase the prices for plants and pass on the inflation to the consumers? And looking forward to 2023, which are the countries where you are confident that you could increase prices in line with inflation. That's my first question.

我的問題是關於 AMX 的定價權。那麼在主要市場中，哪些市場可以提高植物價格並將通貨膨脹轉嫁給消費者？展望 2023 年，您可以確信哪些國家的價格能夠以通貨膨脹率上調。這是我的第一個問題。

I think we have been increasing prices in some countries, not in all of them. Let's say, Mexico, we haven't increased prices. We feel comfortable in Mexico in the peak. There's a lot of competition sorry, in the mobile, a lot of competition in the peak. So it doesn't look easy to increase prices there but in other countries, we were increasing and depending a lot we're going to see. The inflation is high. So of course, we're looking where we can -- where we're going to increase prices in 2023.

我認為我們只是在某些國家提高了價格，但並非所有國家都提高了價格。比如說，墨西哥，我們沒有提高價格。我們在墨西哥的巔峰時期感覺很舒服。很抱歉，在行動領域，競爭非常激烈，高峰的競爭非常激烈。因此，在那裡提高價格看起來並不容易，但在其他國家，我們的價格正在上漲，我們將會看到很大的變化。通貨膨脹率很高。因此，我們當然正在尋找可以提高價格的地方——2023 年我們將在哪裡提高價格。

So in 2022, yes, we already do. We already do some countries. And as I said, in Mexico and in other countries also we don't do, so not only Mexico, another one, yes, we do it, and we were successfully increasing prices good. but we're reviewing 2023, and we're going to see where it makes sense for us to increase prices. Of course, we know that inflation is high costs are increasing. So we have to work hard on cutting costs and also in some places, increased prices, depending on the competition.

所以在 2022 年，是的，我們已經這麼做了。我們已經在一些國家開展業務。正如我所說的，在墨西哥和其他國家我們也不會這樣做，所以不僅是墨西哥，在另一個國家，是的，我們也這樣做，我們成功地提高了價格。但我們正在審查 2023 年的情況，我們將看看在什麼情況下提高價格才合理。當然，我們知道通貨膨脹率高，成本也在增加。因此，我們必須努力削減成本，並且在某些地方，根據競爭情況提高價格。

What we were saying before, I think that we expect currencies in revision we likely be stronger than the year-to-date. So that gives some relief on the cost side for FX-related acquisitions, content and the like.

正如我們之前所說的，我認為我們預計修訂後的貨幣可能會比今年迄今為止的貨幣走強。這會在一定程度上減輕與外匯相關的收購、內容等的成本負擔。

But it's something that we're looking every month to see exactly cost competition, prices, promotions, everything. So that's what we need to do all this year.

但我們每個月都會關注它，準確了解成本競爭、價格、促銷等一切。所以這就是我們今年需要做的事情。

My second question is regarding the labor obligations. I think you had a EUR 24 billion of obligations outflow this year. How do you see the outflow going forward? And the recent negotiations with Telmex, how do you expect that to impact the labor obligations outflow going forward?

我的第二個問題是關於勞動義務。我認為今年的債務流出量為240億歐元。您如何看待未來的資金流出？最近與 Telmex 的談判，您認為這將如何影響未來的勞工義務流出？

You have some important comments. So the labor obligations we are presenting the use of our cash flow is basically what is called out. That is not coming from the pension fund itself. We have a pension fund in Telmex and the pension plan in Telmex sometimes, we would want to keep it more funded, and that's why we haven't been withdrawing as much. But we expect that the amount that will be coming out of the -- our own cash flow as opposed to the fund itself is going to be some quite smaller than what we saw for last year, okay? So I think that we will start to see some reduction.

您有一些重要的評論。因此，我們所呈現的利用現金流的勞動義務基本上就是所謂的。這並不是來自退休基金本身。我們在 Telmex 有退休基金，有時我們希望 Telmex 的退休金計畫能有更多的資金，這就是我們沒有提取太多資金的原因。但我們預計，從我們自己的現金流（而不是基金本身）流出的金額將比去年的金額小一些，好嗎？因此我認為我們將開始看到一些減少。

The pension fund of Telmex, the assets have increased significantly. I think it's a larger percentage of the obligations. So I think that we are happy to take out a bit more of that fund and a little bit less of our customer.

Telmex的退休基金，資產大幅增加。我認為這是較大比例的義務。因此我認為，我們樂意從該基金中多拿出一點，少拿出一點我們的客戶。

And the next question goes to [Luca Brenton] of Bank of America.

下一個問題請問美國銀行的 [Luca Brenton]。

So it is related to the Brazilian mobile market. And well, since the (inaudible) consolidation, we saw that both prices, ARPU and net adds have been really strong. So my 2 questions are in relation to ARPU, if you believe that there's strong sequence to continue and if higher price hikes will be the new structure of the business or if this will only keep up in the short term? And then also in net adds, if you believe that those will be sustained at least in the short term.

所以這與巴西移動市場有關。而且，自從（聽不清楚）合併以來，我們看到價格、ARPU 和淨增加值都非常強勁。所以我的兩個問題是關於 ARPU 的，您是否認為這種強勁的趨勢會持續下去，更高的價格上漲是否會成為業務的新結構，或者這是否只會在短期內持續下去？然後，在淨增量方面，如果您相信這些至少在短期內會持續下去。

Well, I think we have a good business in the mobile side (inaudible). In last purchase of oil customers, we do very good synergy there. I think we incorporate those customers and good costs. In terms of ARPU, we increased some prices in Brazil, so ARPUs are growing. And we have good quality. We have good distribution, good cost working a lot on coverage and also 5G. So we feel that we can continue to invest (technical difficulty).

嗯，我認為我們在行動端的業務很好（聽不清楚）。在上次石油客戶的採購中，我們在那裡實現了非常好的綜效。我認為我們將這些客戶和良好的成本結合在一起。就ARPU而言，我們在巴西提高了一些價格，因此ARPU正在成長。而我們的品質優良。我們擁有良好的分佈，良好的成本，在覆蓋範圍和 5G 方面做了很多工作。所以我們覺得可以繼續投資（技術難度）。

And the next question goes to Andres Coello of Scotiabank.

下一個問題請問加拿大豐業銀行的 Andres Coello。

Carlos, you already mentioned the pension fund. Can you perhaps busy comment on the relevance of the potential conversion of Telmex pension liabilities into stock? Would you have perhaps any specific targets on what percentage of potential liability could be converted? And what will be the value proposition to workers?

卡洛斯，您已經提到了退休基金。您能否評論一下將 Telmex 退休金債務轉換為股票的潛在相關性？對於潛在責任可轉換的百分比，您是否有任何具體目標？對工人來說價值主張是什麼？

Well, I think it's still in the stages of this. I think this is so far a concept that has been floated. I think to the extent that there's a conversion of pension rights for Telmex equity, that obviously puts the company on a stronger position because it's overall liabilities would be thereby reduced. And to the extent that's the case, the equity can take some more value over time because it will be equity of a company that will be stronger. So I think that's conceptually what is. I think there's everything else oil and this concept remains to be worked out. So I don't think that I can give you more light on that. But I think the concept is easy to understand.

嗯，我認為它仍處於這個階段。我認為這是迄今為止已經提出的概念。我認為，如果退休金權利轉換為 Telmex 股權，這顯然會使公司處於更有利的地位，因為它的整體負債將會減少。在這種情況下，隨著時間的推移，股權的價值會越來越高，因為它將成為一家更強大的公司的股權。所以我認為這從概念上來說就是這樣的。我認為還有其他一切，石油，這個概念還有待解決。因此我認為我無法就此給你更多解釋。但我認為這個概念很容易理解。

And my second question will be on Colombia. We've seen weaker results in recent quarters, some margin compression. As you mentioned in the press release that you've seen more pressure on the broadband segment. If you perhaps can elaborate a little bit on where that pressure is coming from? Is it's from (inaudible) or if it's from Telefonica. Just a little bit more color on Colombia.

我的第二個問題是關於哥倫比亞的。我們發現最近幾季的業績較弱，利潤率有所壓縮。正如您在新聞稿中提到的那樣，您發現寬頻領域面臨更大的壓力。能否稍微詳細說明一下這種壓力來自哪裡？它是來自（聽不清楚）還是來自西班牙電信？稍微多介紹一下哥倫比亞。

I think what you see in Colombia is the one starts maybe 1.5 years ago, very aggressive in the mobile side. So we start to be -- also all the markets start to be more aggressive. But you could see the trends on the mobile. The mobile lease is starting to grow again. We grow this quarter 4.5%. It's good. So we used to grow 1 or even right now, we're growing. So on the mobile side, I think things are getting to growth again.

我認為哥倫比亞的情況是大約一年半前開始的，並且在行動領域非常積極。因此我們開始——所有市場也開始變得更加積極。但你可以在行動裝置上看到這一趨勢。行動租賃又開始成長。本季我們成長了4.5%。很好。所以我們過去的成長是 1，甚至現在，我們也在成長。因此，我認為在移動方面，事情正在再次恢復增長。

On the fixed side, well, it's a decision. I think the market is very competitive prices are going down. We decided to compete. So we are -- our ARPU is reducing a little bit. But at the end of the day, I think that's what we need to do. So it's going to take a little bit of time to recover. We are putting a lot more fiber all around Colombia. I think we have a very good offer and that's it, no more than that. It's not only one competitor. I think the market is under a big competition in the fixed side. And what we're doing is we are competing. So we -- that's what we have there is fiber for contracting fiber.

從固定的角度來說，這是一個決定。我認為市場競爭非常激烈，價格正在下降。我們決定參加比賽。所以我們的 ARPU 正在稍微下降。但最終，我認為這就是我們需要做的。因此恢復需要一點時間。我們正在哥倫比亞各地鋪設更多的光纖。我認為我們的報價非常好，僅此而已。競爭對手不只一個。我認為固定端的市場競爭非常激烈。我們正在做的就是競爭。所以，我們 — — 這就是我們所擁有的用於收縮纖維的纖維。

We are also doing fiber and prices are going a little bit down. So we decided to complete that more or less while we do promotions. We do some things to compete in the market. That's more or less what is happening in Colombia. It's not one competitor or the other one is the market.

我們也生產光纖，價格正在稍微下降。因此，我們決定在進行促銷的同時或多或少地完成這一目標。我們做一些事情來在市場上競爭。這或多或少就是哥倫比亞正在發生的事情。這不是一個競爭對手，也不是另一個競爭對手，而是市場。

And our final question today goes to Marcelo Santos of JPMorgan.

今天的最後一個問題是問摩根大通的馬塞洛桑托斯 (Marcelo Santos)。

I wanted to ask your views on FWA, fixed wire lack access. How does América Móvil see that? Do you think there's potential? You mentioned that in Mexico, you are losing some of those subscribers as fiber advances in the country. So is that something you think could be useful on LATAM or even in Europe? Or do you think it's a technology that's going to go down as fiber keeps growing?

我想問一下您對 FWA 和固定線路缺乏接入的看法。 América Móvil 對此有何看法？您認為有潛力嗎？您提到，隨著墨西哥光纖網路的發展，該國正在失去一些用戶。那麼，您認為這在 LATAM 甚至歐洲有用嗎？或者您認為隨著光纖的不斷發展，這種技術將會衰退嗎？

I think it's going to be a good fiber. It's also important where you put it, okay? If it's going to be in a house where they already have fiber, and they already have WiFi and fiber and everything, well, it's going to be difficult to enter that, but there's a lot of places all around Latin America where you don't have fiber. The speeds are not so good. And fixed wireless access, it's good. We have around 4 million fixed wireless access in Latin America. They grew a lot in the -- during the -- by the pandemia (sic) [pandemic] and slowing the growth right now. But I think there's still very good room for this service.

我認為它將是一種很好的纖維。把它放在哪裡也很重要，懂嗎？如果要在一個已經有光纖的房屋里安裝網絡，並且已經有 WiFi 和光纖等一切設備，那麼進入那裡將會很困難，但拉丁美洲有很多地方沒有光纖。速度不太好。固定無線接入也很好。我們在拉丁美洲擁有約400萬固定無線存取。由於疫情，它們的成長很快，現在成長正在放緩。但我認為這項服務還有很大的發展空間。

It's going to be very difficult for the fiber to cover all the places, all the territories, and I think it's a good product there. It's also important in low and then the low and medium density areas, okay, where it's difficult to put fiber or so. I think it's -- we're going to have a good competition. There's also the satellite business that are putting some I think this product is better than a satellite business. Also, there's going to be places where we fix wireless factors don't go in. So it's also an opportunity for the satellite business of, I think, to cover all Latin America with broadband, you need to have all the service, now it's fiber, fixed wireless as and then satellite. So that's what you're going to see in the next year.

光纖要涵蓋所有地方、所有領土將會非常困難，但我認為它在那裡是一個好產品。這對於低密度、低密度和中等密度區域也很重要，因為這些區域很難放置光纖等。我認為——我們將會進行一場良好的競爭。還有衛星業務正在投入一些我認為這個產品比衛星業務更好。此外，有些地方我們不會考慮無線因素。這就是你明年將會看到的事情。

Just a follow-up, but do you think it's going to be like relevant, you grow substantially versus the fiber wired broadband or is always going to remain kind of a more niche product?

只是一個後續問題，但您是否認為它將具有相關性，與光纖有線寬頻相比是否會大幅增長，或者它始終保持為更小眾的產品？

It's a difficult question, depending in some places depending for what you use that depending if the fiber you already have fiber in your house, depending if you are going to deploy what -- it's not the same price to deploy fiber in a city than to deploy fiber in low densities areas. It's depending a lot on the use of that because this one you can move it wherever you want in your house, the other one you have to put the WiFi in basis, WiFi mesh. So I think it's -- there's going to be a market for all these products. Of course, I think fiber is going to be the biggest one, but there is going to be for this one -- the fixed wireless assets and also for satellite in -- and more in Latin America but in all the countries .

這是一個很難的問題，在某些地方取決於您使用什麼，取決於您家中是否已經有光纖，取決於您要部署什麼——在城市部署光纖與在低密度地區部署光纖的價格是不一樣的。這在很大程度上取決於用途，因為這個你可以把它移到你家裡的任何地方，另一個你必須把 WiFi 放在基礎上，WiFi 網狀結構。所以我認為所有這些產品都會有市場。當然，我認為光纖將是最大的一個，但除了固定無線資產之外，還有衛星資產，在拉丁美洲以及所有國家都有更多。

As there are no additional questions waiting at this time. I'd like to hand the conference back over to Daniel Hajj for closing remarks.

因為目前沒有其他問題需要回答。我想將會議交還給丹尼爾·哈吉 (Daniel Hajj) 並請他作最後發言。

I just want to thank all of you for being in the call. Thank you very much.

我只是想感謝大家參加這次電話會議。非常感謝。

Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference. Thank you for joining. You may now disconnect your lines.

女士們、先生們，今天的會議到此結束。感謝您的加入。現在您可以斷開線路了。